Something i noticed about Heroens

phantom000 — Mon, 07 Nov 2011 02:48:09 +1000

My favorite kind of hero is a mental hero who does whatever he does primarily with his wits. People like Sherlock Holmes, Batman, The Doctor even Jack Sparrow and to a lesser extent Aladdin and Bilbo Baggins. Then i noticed something there aren't a lot of female heroes like that. Oh sure there are a few, Emma Peel from The Avengers, Hermione Granger from Harry Potter and Barbara Gordon as Oracle after she was injured but there doesn't seem to be quite as many as the men. It seems like whenever someone wants to make a strong female lead they make another Xena or Wonder Woman, maybe it's just me. Is it?

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

Cobalt Red — Mon, 07 Nov 2011 03:24:03 +1000

Black Widow definitely relies on her wits, but you're right. The only other female heroes I can think of like that are people like Catwoman and Electra, who are better known for their ninja skills.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

valleyradionerd — Mon, 07 Nov 2011 05:08:38 +1000

Are you kidding? Tanya Huff's Torin Kerr and Vicki Nelson are, yes, badass but they're mostly better than everyone else because they're smarter than everyone else. Same goes for L.M. Bujold's Cordelia and Ekaterine, Pratchett's Susan is just the single most sensible person on the disc, same with Granny Weatherwax and Tiffany Aching. Then there's Ripley (Alien), and Laura Holt (Remington Steele), and Cagney and Lacey, and River (Firefly, though she is both) Never mind most of George Bernard Shaw's women. Then there's Emma Frost, whose powers are all about her brain, and the heroines of a good third of the mystery novels (Ms Marple, Rita Mae Brown's Harry, Garrison Allen's Penelope) Partially though, I think it is because we've had centuries of women only having their wits (Elizabeth Bennett, Jane Eyre, Beatrice "oh, god, if I were a man", Viola) and having women be physically badass is still somewhat new. Granny Weatherwax is the ultimate brains over brawn and powers heroine, actually, if you're feeling bereft of them go read Terry Pratchett. Especially the Wee Free Men books.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

CarrieAnne — Thu, 10 Nov 2011 04:05:22 +1000

Also, Tamora Pierce writes smart female heroines, but not just physically strong. Her stories are also just generally amazing. :)

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

GreyBones206 — Thu, 10 Nov 2011 04:15:22 +1000

I like the three sisters in Charmed. They're smart and can kick warlock @ss.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

SquidBulb — Thu, 10 Nov 2011 05:24:45 +1000

How about some of the female characters in Doctor Who? It's not a book, but still, I think that's what you mean.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

KatnissGinnyMaxTally — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 01:21:14 +1000

There is Tory in Virals, Katniss from The Hunger Games, Max from Maximum Ride, Alanna from The Song of the Lioness, (I'm looking at my bookshelf) Violet Baeudelaire from Series of Unfortunate Events, Eva Nine from The Search for WondLa, Katsa from Graceling, Fire from Fire, Annabeth from Percy Jackson & The Olympians, etc. I guess I know this because I tend to enjoy books from a strong heroine perspective. :)

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

Invisible Ninja — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 03:00:21 +1000

I think Katniss might go 50/50 (although she doesn't seem to be incredibly smart sometimes), but Maximum is more brawn than brains I think.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

christybum — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 03:29:55 +1000

what about Arwen Jean Grey Rogue Mystique Princess leia

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

Steampunk avi8or — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 06:40:24 +1000

Granny Weatherwax rules! I like Nanny Ogg better though. Especially in Maskerade Nanny was amazing.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

ImmaSammich — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 19:59:23 +1000

Yup. Aly was specifically the first girl I thought of when I read the first post. A spymaster needs some major thinking power. Dove in the same series too definitely. They stand out the most to me, for the "primarily their wits" part, but Beka definitely fits the bill too. It really is pretty much everyone actually. Except maybe Alanna, who probably would fit the bill if she weren't so short-tempered and let herself think and plan things out more. So, essentially, completely agreed. Especially on the amazing stories.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

phantom000 — Tue, 29 Nov 2011 10:19:28 +1000

Arwen doesn't do much that requires a great deal of intelligence or a person to be clever, least not in the movie. Jean Grey doesn't count because she uses mutant powers, yes her powers are based in the mind but you don't have to be smart to be an effective telepath, why i didn't list heroes of Luke Skywalker or Superman. Mystique...i really don't know if she qualifies as a hereon or not... Leia is nice an all but you don't see her trying to think her way out of most situations.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

The_Halla — Tue, 29 Nov 2011 15:34:42 +1000

Lisbeth Salander, The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo Temperance Brennan, the Bones series Meg Murry, A Wrinkle in Time Tuesday Next, The Eyre Affair and others Motoko Kusanagi, Ghost in the Shell (OK, she's 50/50, but the equivalent of 75/75...) Mattie Ross, True Grit Deryn Sharp, Leviathan Flavia de Luce, The Sweetness at the Bottom of the Pie Cassie Maddox, Into the Woods and The Likeness Lyra Belacqua, His Dark Materials trilogy Susan and Lucy Pevensie, The Chronicles of Narnia Sophie Hatter, Howl's Moving Castle OK, admittedly, most of these characters are detectives or children, but my point still stands. (You mentioned Sherlock Holmes and Hermione Granger, after all...)

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

valleyradionerd — Wed, 30 Nov 2011 02:04:34 +1000

Actually the reason I like classic Rogue (NOT the new movie version, thank you, though she does have her points) is that she often plays the classic Hero role. Sometimes it is about thinking but often it is because she is, with the build up of powers she has attained the strongest or most powerful. She fights the main bad guy and saves the princess (and yes, I love her a great deal) because, even when she isn't the brains (which isn't to say she isn't smart, she certainly is) she is STRONG. And ditto what Phantom said about Arwen. Despite the movie Tolkien's Arwen pretty much does...nothing. Luthien wasn't an idiot, though, quite helpful, really. And some other women from the Silmarillion. (not so much the LOTR, unfortunately)

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

valleyradionerd — Wed, 30 Nov 2011 02:05:39 +1000

So happy you mentioned Meg Murry and Sophie Hatter!! I think huge amounts of Diana Wynne Jone's women count for this.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

meils121 — Wed, 30 Nov 2011 03:52:26 +1000

So happy someone mentioned her! Her books always have the most amazing, strong and smart female leads. She's one of my absolutely favorite authors. Another one: The Enchanted Forest Chronicles. The female lead (Cimorene) is extremely smart, and even though she does know sword fighting, etc, she relies on her wits to get herself out of most situations. A later book in the series has Morwen, who is also very smart.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

valleyradionerd — Wed, 30 Nov 2011 10:54:21 +1000

I can't believe I forgot Morwen! Heck, all of Patricia C. Wrede's women are just sooooo amazing (yes, fangirl moment) Raven Ring, Daughter of Witches, all of those. They're all amazing.

Re: Something i noticed about Heroens

KatnissGinnyMaxTally — Mon, 09 Jan 2012 11:07:09 +1000

When I think about it, yeah. Max could think things through a little more. :)