Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 02:08:58 +1100

The Pen has moved to the Roleplaying forum. The Pen can be confusing even for those of us who have been there since it was opened in 2008 by Kopiluwak. *standing ovation for Kopi* When I suggested a guide for next year, Starshine501 asked if we could have one this year. So here's a beginning. I don't expect to get everything in this first post! Just like the Pen, this will be a group endeavor. Y'all can ask questions and the veterans can answer, and by the end we'll have lots of ideas for what will need to be in next year's guide. First, here are places you can read previous year's Smoking Pen creations. Each is about novel length. 2008: http://images.dixiegirlsplace.multiply.multiplycontent.com/attachment/0/STTWzwoKCtUAAE@0WKc1/smoking%20pen.pdf?key=dixiegirlsplace:journal:519&nmid=141029408 2009: http://images.dixiegirlsplace.multiply.multiplycontent.com/attachment/0/Tpy@UQooCy0AAHSyU4c1/smoking%20pen%202009.pdf?key=dixiegirlsplace:journal:1579&nmid=493015158 Maybe we'll get the 2010 version up. Eventually. Next, the posts are a blend of reality and fiction. Each author decides for themselves how they want to participate. We try to get a story line going during October, some mystery or other, that gets solved before Nov 1. I think the delay in the website this year threw off our timing for that. The characters and participants. This is where it gets confusing, I guess. Serge was introduced as a barista in 2008 by pteradactyl7 (Steve). I think he'd become the bartender by the end of November that year. He always knows what you want to drink and how you like it prepared. This is because he's telepathic. In the Pen he keeps his mental shields up, blocking 'your' extraneous thoughts. (I think anyone truly telepathic would have to do this in order to stay sane.) Oh, yeah, his name is French (Spanish Sergio, Russian Sergei, French Serge), and his background before coming to the Pen is mostly mystery. We try to keep it that way because it's fun to have a mystery man about the place. Also in 2008 Serge's identical twin Siggurd was brought in by Kopi. Sig was a con man who preyed on folks who trust Serge. Brucedeuce was his first victim. Sig made a brief reappearance in Dec 2009 and may have been killed off. (Sig didn't have the telepathic abilities and hated Serge.) Manuel is a chef introduced by Treefrog (Nina) in 2009. He hasn't been around much since Keme came in, but might reappear. Keme, the red haired Algonquin, was introduced last year (2010) by Kopi. He always knows what you want to eat. Tshah is his sister-in-law, if I remember right. She's the warrior of the family. He made a large batch of Time Tarts for her that were to be used in a special ceremony (never explained) but the tarts were stolen (perp never found). Willis is one of Treefrog's characters that she brought in, I think in 2009. He's a cute kid and was quickly adopted by us all. He 'escaped' from her novel, preferring to work in the Pen as a barista. This year Serge is training him to work the bar as well. Woape is new this year and her character hasn't been developed yet. So far we know she gets nervous around Serge and is very creative. You can view story lines in the Pen as writing challenges. Generally there isn't any planning. Each writer does a small bit, leaving openings for others to follow. We'll pull each other in sometimes. A perfect example of that is this year when Serge started throwing pans in the kitchen. Look how Dixie set me up to deal with it. No, I had no idea that was coming! This sort of thing also played a role in developing the relationship between 'Kat' and Serge. (2009 is when a lot of that happened.) I quickly realized that the real me wasn't going to have a 'relationship' with a fictional character, even though he'd intrigued me from early on. So I developed a fictional 'Kat,' designed specifically to appeal to Serge, based on the idea that he takes care of everyone in the Pen and who's taking care of him??? Okay, that's all I got at the moment. Questions?

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

benjan — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 06:24:51 +1100

Such a good idea, Kat. Thanks! I tried to draw people in with my lost plot idea, but I guess I didn't do it right. Oh, well. Next time, when I'm no longer a newbie. Here's my 2 cents: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4184192 Hopefully, the link works. It is an NPR interview called The Simple Art of Writing Novels from Nov. 24, 2004 with Chris Baty and the REAL cliff Brooks. Yes, Virginia, there is a Cliff Brooks.

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dancingfool — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 07:21:23 +1100

Barb - don't get discouraged.. There are a couple factors at work here. First, people keep popping in and out (I think most of us still work, so we pop in briefly in the morning, and then again in the evening).Next is the reality that - if someone posts WHILE you're reading, and you do a response, without refreshing (darn, I never remember to refresh), obviously your response will not take their post into consideration. Finally, there are so many of us, at the moment, that it's not possible to follow up on on the little hints, and straight lines. Hmmm... I have one more, so this is the real 'finally'... sometimes, something just hits someone the right way. For example, there was a passing reference to a ukelele string...for some reason that stuck in my head. So on one visit I stepped over it... and in a later visit, I returned it to Dragon. Truly a minor, forgettable point. It's not a matter of doing it wrong or right, it's just a matter of the factors coming into play in the right way. And Kat -- thank you for the character list. I'd caught references to Siggurd, but didn't quite get it.. and was a bit fuzzy on a couple things. But -- you asked for Qs. How about something about Cliff Brooks, and I'll let you decide whether to give a brief word or two about muses, and plot bunnies... and the physical layout of the Pen. (and thanks for taking on this challenge!)

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 07:42:46 +1100

The Pen has morphed a few times but the basic layout is probably like most real life places where people congregate. From previous years there is a heavily studded entry door that allows entry into a foyer where there is a entry to Kopi's balcony, doors to the restroom, and a hidden doorway to the celler (behind potted palms and plants). When you enter the bar proper, you see various tables in the center, booths line the walls, and the huge maple bar is made form a single tree with a traditional brass rail and has a high sheen. There are patio doors at one end that open to a patio with a pool and hot tubs and beyond this are tennis courts and rolling hills and mountains in the distance. In theory you can add things but some of us get uncomfortable when the overall structure has changed and we always write it when that happens. LOL, we're creatures of habit I guess. There are rooms upstairs (Serge lives there) and this year Kopi added more balconies for the writers but there are so many newbies no one caught that. . . yet. The cellar is vast. There is where all the beverages are kept. Huge vats and dark corridors. Typical mysterious cellar. You can enter the cellar from the secret passage in the foyer or from the typical stairs off the kitchen. The door to the kitchen is in the wall behind the bar.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 07:45:02 +1100

I forget who put the Cliff Brooks statue in place but it went in the first year. He's a fixture that gets referred to a lot but overall he's just there, and we know he's there. Mountain Bluebird, a first year patron, used his upraised finger as her perch. We don't know exactly which finger he has raised. No one specifically says. Cliff Brooks was a challenge that went out. Everyone was to kill him in their novel. Thus the memorial statue was erected for the eternal victim.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 08:13:20 +1100

Barb, the link works (copied and pasted). I think I heard this when it was broadcast but it was great to hear it again. Especially with that question about Cliff Brooks. Based on what The Cliff Brooks said in that NPR show, someone laughed at a scene in his horror novel, so by the next day he'd introduced that person into his book and killed him off. In response, Cliff was killed off in that person's novel. The info ended up in the forums, and Cliff Brooks became the person to kill off in your novel. I don't remember when his statue was added to the Pen. There's a fan/filter system within the statue so smokers can sit in that area and the smoke won't bother anyone else. Added bonus is the smoke exhausts out of the pen on the roof... I didn't pick up on the missing plot because I couldn't figure out where to take it. Sorry, Barb, I had a really rough week at work. To help avoid the issue of the story line moving along while you type your post, I create the post in a word processing document, and refresh the Pen before I post. When it's busy sometimes I have to edit two or three times before I finally get it up.

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Kat Gentian — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 08:15:24 +1100

There's a freight elevator, too, variously located. It's modern, efficient, but makes sounds like it's in an old tenement.

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benjan — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 08:43:32 +1100

I'm glad the link works. It was fun to listen to. It's also nice to have the description of the Pen in one location, instead of spread out through out the story lines. Thanks, all. I'm not discouraged or upset that my missing plot thing didn't work out. Maybe a little disappointed, but I took a chance and it didn't work out. I think I got impatient and nervous, so I felt that I needed to end it. Even if it didn't work out the way I had hoped as a little mystery for the Pen, I had fun with it, and that's what writing is to me. Like I said, maybe next year. Oh, noes! Is this the beginning stages of NaNoWriMo Returnitis?

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Starshine501 — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 11:48:30 +1100

Whoa, Kat, this is super! In 2009, I came late to the Pen, and gave up completely on following the thread. I never even walked down the street in front of it in 2010. This year I thought I'd make a stab at keeping up with the goings-on, but have already fallen far behind. So, basically, I've been perched on a sawed-off tree trunk that sits across from the entrance, watching people come and go, and catching occasional glimpses of the interior as the door opens and shuts. This thread might give me the background I need for the confidence to enter (we introverts like to assess from the sidelines before venturing into new experiences). THANK YOU, Kat!

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Auld Soul — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 13:19:05 +1100

I stopped into the The Pen in 2009 and 2010 but got lost very quickly as people seemed to know each other so well and I had no clue about what had gone on it the past. Both years it didn't take me long to sneak out the door in the dead of night when no one was around. It continues to be a fascinating place. However, even though I read the new posts every day, I'll continue to lurk outside and peer through the windows from the shadows. All the writers are awesome and so very entertaining!

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Dixiegirl — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 14:24:09 +1100

I remember you coming in a few times and I think we had a few "drinks". You should just pop back around and sit a spell!

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Mon, 24 Oct 2011 01:28:42 +1100

Doug Story asking for the check reminded me! In the Pen we don't pay with money, but with our best efforts to increase our word counts in November.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Tue, 25 Oct 2011 01:11:57 +1100

After reading over the original posts I realized we had the Pen description nailed down pretty quickly and it hasn't changed much. Kopi keeps setting up each year and she is cautious adding things. And we're pretty cautious taking them down! LOL. Serge was reported to live upstairs and one year events even moved to the cellar and to the upstairs. There was quite a lot that happened in those cellars! So there was expansion but limited. You mentioned in your first post that these could be viewed as writing challenges. I think that's pretty good. That's what I use them for. I like seeing how I can develop the scene I'm in. If I set one up, I like to see if the next person I put in the scene can develop the scene even further. Sometimes it flops. Sometimes it is extraordinary! One year Kat and I got on such a roll collaborating that we had to actually leave the Pen and set up the Inkwell to develop the story that seemed to explode for us to keep from annoying people! I think we both learned that writing in collaboration is very hard work but that it is also a lot of fun if you can keep your sanity and cooperate. Working together on the story became almost an obsession for us. But I'm sure we both had times when we got annoyed because the other person didn't go the way we wanted. We usually discussed our ideas ahead of time to work these out. But it can be frustrating when two people have different ideas. The Pen shows this clearly. The best thing to do is follow the lead of the person who started the scene. Sometimes you won't want to enter a scene but may get pulled in. You can write yourself out of it. Or you can try and get a sense of what they are wanting to do. I'll usually pull out if I think a scene is not something I can follow or if it simply doesn't interest me. It isn't personal. I may just have other things going on or I may know nothing about what is happening or I may be simply bored. What I envision may not be what you envision for any scene. That's fine. The Patrons may comment on what they are seeing but generally won't enter a scene until they are sure of the direction it is going or they are invited by the original writer to appear in the scene. I'll usually stand back and watch and assess what I think I should do. Some people simply want to watch the action, commenting here and there but never to be dragged into to another reality. They like sitting in a bar and watching. You always have to keep in mind that it's all fiction and it is very very different from other forums. It is not a personal diary and not autobiographies. Its a game that develops as you go. To get other writers to participate you've got to be on your toes and get a scene going that has potential for expansion. Sitting at the bar talking about the weather probably won't do that. But, seeing Agatha conspire with a suspicious character while you're sitting at the bar... well, that is something someone can run with. (see the original Smoking Pen to know who Agatha is.) Talking about your novel is all well and good but there isn't much anyone can do with it. So your scene will die in that post. But if your computer was infected with an unknown virus and a screen popped up that said, "Now you'll have more time to spend in the Pen!" That's something someone could get a handle on if they want to play. I can't remember who but one writer made a statement that said something like this: take something ordinary and something extraordinary and put them together. That's very true of the Pen. Biggest thing to remember is that this is for fun. Once it is over.... its over. The Pen is Kopi's creation that she shared with us all. Next year, if Kopi sets up the Pen.... it will be all new ideas and players. If she doesn't, we'll all go back to our boring realities. With really fond memories. Honestly, its all about writing. By November 1, it will slow down a lot and by the 30 it will be over. So enjoy it while it last.

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Timkford — Tue, 25 Oct 2011 02:12:25 +1100

Hang on Kopi - she? Do I get everything wrong? So she hasn't really got a splendid moustache. (I do have an excuse since my laptop fell off my lap the screen is different. (Pass my apologieson to Kopi). (I broke my space bar as well, and i don't always tab back and put spaces where they should be)

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Dixiegirl — Tue, 25 Oct 2011 09:37:52 +1100

Oh Tim... Kat and I saw that! LOL, we just thought you were drunk!

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Timkford — Tue, 25 Oct 2011 09:40:50 +1100

Permanently stupid - sometimes sober

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Dixiegirl — Tue, 25 Oct 2011 14:16:51 +1100

Well.... no harm done.... and a bit of a laugh.

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Dixiegirl — Tue, 25 Oct 2011 14:18:56 +1100

Oh, and Kopi does have a splendid moustace in her avatar but this is the first photo she's ever had up of a person. Even I did a double take. I don't even know if it is Kopi or someone else.

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bernie_noble — Wed, 26 Oct 2011 05:48:10 +1100

Kat wrote: To help avoid the issue of the story line moving along while you type your post, I create the post in a word processing document, and refresh the Pen before I post. When it's busy sometimes I have to edit two or three times before I finally get it up. ----------------- This is the first place I have participated in that I've run into the "refresh" concept this way (ran into it when trying to upload my avatar too). Can someone explain? THanks

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Wed, 26 Oct 2011 13:10:57 +1100

I will try. "Refresh" re-loads the page and adds the new entries that may have been made while you were reading. Most browsers have a button with a half-circle arrow. If you hover over it, text appears like "refresh" or "reload current page" or something like that. Push the button and let the browser do its thing. Page is refreshed. It is most useful on pages that update rapidly. When there are many people online posting to the Pen (which I have just randomly selected as my example *stares at ceiling and whistles*), if you organize your response in the reply window, you may find by the time you're done and actually post it, multiple others have posted in between and now your post no longer fits the story line. By composing in a file on your computer, you can check what's happening as you're writing, and do one last refresh before you copy your text into the reply window and hit submit. This reduces (but does not eliminate) the chances of your post not 'fitting.' Did I help or just confuse you more???

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Dixiegirl — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 01:10:33 +1100

We never told who Simon was and he's been prominent for a while, although he doesn't belong to the Pen exactly. Simon is a long time friend of Serge. They both "worked" for the same people using their psychic abilities, which are rather extensive. Serge left this employment and Simon stayed. Hey, its good money for a night's work. They have been at odds for a long time but at the end of the day, they're still friends. He is able to read minds but his best ability is that he is able to enter a person's dreams while they sleep and retrieve information and if needed insert information or misinformation. This ability can mentally disable or kill a person if done incorrectly. He pops into the Pen now and again. He's Dixie's man more or less... its an on again off again relationship. He doesn't carry or use weapons. He won't kill unless it is necessary and he uses his abilities to do that.

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Kopiluwak — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 02:24:54 +1100

Actually, The Smoking Pen was created towards the end of November 2006 and it originally had recliners with power outlets, wifi and dial-up, a fireplace with a cat named Calumph, the bar - and Serge was known as "Sergei". At some point, he lost the "i". Probably because of BruceDuece. We didn't have age group forums back then, so the Smoking Pen was in the Writing Groups forum as a thread that frequently got lost. It was never stickied that year. I'm surprised anyone found it. One of the regulars was having issues with her cable guy. He claimed her cats were "vicious" and refused to install her cable. His name was Cliff Brooks, so we all offered to kill him in interesting ways in our NaNos, and shared them with her. She eventually got her cable installed, but not by Cliff Brooks. There was no real mystery developed that year, it was mostly people playing around and testing the limits. There was a good deal of personal chatter, writing chatter, and lots of intrigue that didn't really go anywhere. In 2007, the Smoking Pen returned, with Serge and a statue of Cliff Brooks. That year, we added the pool and the pool guy Manuel. The basement also was added, and Serge's quarters upstairs. At some point, the dial-up was dropped (although, there are still recliners off in the corner with dial-up capabilities should anyone using dial-up need them).. It wasn't stickied that year, either, and we still didn't have a specific age group forum for it to be in. That was the year Chris Baty realized we older writers were a vital and very active part of NaNo and he surveyed us to see what we wanted. I suggested the Smoking Pen be it's very own forum so we could have different threads. In 2008, we got the Age Group 50+ forum, and the Smoking Pen was stickied for the first time. That's when it really kicked off. When you read the saved copy of the 2008 Smoking Pen, there are occasional references back to the earlier years. I wonder what happened to Calumph?

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Kopiluwak — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 02:27:29 +1100

That's me, in steampunk, being the Evil Taskmaster of the Dealer's Room at a steampunk convention. The original person in charge of the Dealer's Room was too pregnant to handle it, so I just bulled my way in and took over. It's one of my biggest flaws.

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dancingfool — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 07:53:25 +1100

Wonderful additional info!! I forgot about the pool and Manuel.. and didn't know all the details about Cliff. Hmmm.. I think I can kill him this year.. I'll have to try to do that. SO glad that the Pen is in the 50+... it's what keeps me coming back.. I can certainly see that it wouldn't work in an all ages, especially with (ahem) this year's goings-on, and no disrespect to the other age groups, but i don't think they'd understand. Comment on your recent Pen posting --- NaNoWeen??!!! I don't remember NaNoWeen from last year.. and I don't have a costume ready :-( Well, as long as I'm starting to panic at the notion of Nano being 4 days away, I may as well panic at the idea of what I'll wear to NaNoWeen. (Because I am Definitely going to be there!) As someone (?Sereana?Benjan?) said -- Worrying must work, because anything I worry about, doesn't happen.

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Kopiluwak — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 10:39:52 +1100

I found some of the old archives, and the Smoking Pen was indeed created in 2006 and furthered in 2007, but it was a part of the Writers Groups and the Over 30 (because no one thought anyone older did NaNo back then) threads, and it will be a while teasing the Smoking Pen posts out of them. December. I will do it after NaNo in December. And work on making a nice, lovely cogent collection of the Smoking Pen from its inception to the current year NaNo, then make alink for people to read it, along with the Guide, here, which is very useful!

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Kat Gentian — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 15:20:01 +1100

Thank you, Kopi! I never found the Pen before '08 so didn't know it had existed before that. A collection of all the years in one place would be wonderful, but a lot of work, too! We'll have to be patient... I like your picture. Maybe I'll do a 'real' one for my 10th year, too.

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bernie_noble — Sat, 29 Oct 2011 12:16:50 +1100

Very much helped. Thanks!

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dancingfool — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 08:02:59 +1100

maybe it's just me (and I'm too lazy to check the archives) but I don't recall the Pen having a buffet, last year.

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Kat Gentian — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 08:09:33 +1100

I think they only brought out the buffet for parties before. This is the first year it's been a fixture, at least since '08. Part of the evolution. If folks stop using it, it will go away again. I do prefer the table service myself, even though I've started using the buffet. ;-)

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Timkford — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 09:57:35 +1100

Will you have rooms in the chimneys and links to other nano worlds in the future - or is that just mine?

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Kat Gentian — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 15:09:27 +1100

So far, you have exclusive use of the chimney, Tim. If you need links you may have to establish them yourself. And if someone else wants to join you in there, you'll have to share, I guess. ;-) Now that the weather's turning cold the fireplace will be used quite a bit; do you have contingency plans for that?

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Timkford — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 20:03:27 +1100

Kat - it's only writing spirit that goes up there, not corporeal me. My spirits have no problems with fire (just got to reconstitute itself after being microwaved).

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dancingfool — Mon, 31 Oct 2011 01:38:05 +1100

I think I'm in trouble, bc this latest bit of conversation between Tim and Kat, made sense!

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Kat Gentian — Mon, 31 Oct 2011 02:11:10 +1100

LOL

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RE Garrett — Mon, 31 Oct 2011 03:08:49 +1100

So, Cliff Brooks sounds like that kid in the South Park cartoon--"Ohmigod, they've killed Kenny!" Yes?

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Kat Gentian — Mon, 31 Oct 2011 03:49:23 +1100

Sorry, I'm of no help here. I've never seen South Park. (Haven't watched TV in over twenty years.)

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Timkford — Mon, 31 Oct 2011 04:43:21 +1100

I'll just have to get more surreal and abstract - I'm simply not trying hard enough

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Erica in the novel — Tue, 01 Nov 2011 05:45:59 +1100

It is great seeing all this info. I came in late and just managed a couple of the first pages of the Pen. I think it is way beyond me but it was fun to see a bit of it in action.

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dancingfool — Tue, 01 Nov 2011 06:18:39 +1100

no, no no!!! don't give up, Erica!!! Here's a suggestion.... make sure you're in the nested display, not flat (although I think most of our responses are to the thread, rather than individuals, anyway)... pick a random spot -- say 3 pages or so from the end... and just start reading from there. And then lurk for a bit, and then come on in, the water's fine!! Sure, it will be odd, and a tad confusing at first.. but trust me, we're worth it! btw, I LOVE your avatar. Tuxedo cats rule!!! Our 18 year old tuxedo died in March, and just a few weeks ago, we decided to get another cat -- a tuxedo, of course. The new one (a 3 year old) and our existing one (13 years old) are still adjusting to each other, but it's definitely good. I know that one of the cats in your pic isn't really a tuxedo, but that's ok. A black and white is almost as good ;-)

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Dixiegirl — Tue, 22 Nov 2011 14:40:20 +1100

I just read this! I had no idea! So a real icon! Awesome. I think a full work would be fun.

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Erica in the novel — Tue, 22 Nov 2011 21:01:50 +1100

What a shame, I had no idea you had answered me, dancingfool! I am afraid I did give up. Been putting all of my energy into writing (shouldn't even be here now actually). I am already looking forward to next year and hope the Smoking Pen is back. My boys thank you for the complement and want to know which of them is not a tuxedo. The taller and more while one is Orson, 10 years old (born on 9/11); and the other is Pascal, seven years old. We also have a tabby, Savannah who's 18, and two dogs Wendy, seven and her mother Abebe twelve. Far more info than you were looking for, I'm sure. LOL

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dancingfool — Wed, 23 Nov 2011 09:06:43 +1100

oh... well from this angle, it looked like orson was not a tuxedo... at least I always think of tuxedos as being mostly black, with white on the face and tummy. as it happens, my tuxedo cats have always been girls. sounds like you have a real zoo there. I would imagine the Pen would be back...hope to see you there next year.

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Dixiegirl — Wed, 23 Nov 2011 12:05:10 +1100

As long as Kopi keeps opening the doors, we'll have the Pen.

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Erica in the novel — Wed, 23 Nov 2011 21:42:55 +1100

Cool, I am looking forward to it already! I hope Tim's chimney remains. I could see a future for me there. Kopi,... could there be a extra set of keys made for, you know, emergencies...?

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Erica in the novel — Wed, 23 Nov 2011 21:48:10 +1100

Well, Pascal really does have more of the tuxedo style. Orson is mostly a big baby, especially when he is nursing. Our fault, we had never raised a kitten from a bottle before. It can be a bit of a zoo, particularly at mealtimes. The real zoo, though, is outside our windows. I wish I could really see all the critters out there in the forest.

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Timkford — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 03:27:40 +1100

Hey! Kat says I have exclusive use of the chimney (and by implication the dark chocolate room up there). You better watch out, my tamed black swan witch might microwave trespassers!

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treefrog5700 — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 05:10:13 +1100

I can hardly imagine anyone having exclusive use of a dark chocolate room.

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Erica in the novel — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 09:15:45 +1100

Can we take it over?

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Timkford — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 09:27:11 +1100

There is a fire to get over and a lot of soot. Anyway, you can't get up there in person - you have to release your writing spirit (or any other of your spirits). I can see I might have to make a return to guard my territory, maybe bring something with me to help.

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dancingfool — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 09:38:56 +1100

Dark chocolate??? Here I COME!! Oh wait, a few thousand more words to write, and then I might just have to visit, before NaNo ends. A fire? Soot? pshaw... that's nothing, if the reward is dark chocolate. I've said it before to individuals, (and perhaps once in the Pen? not sure).. but, at least for me, the Pen is an absolute sanity saver for November. The craziness in there, keeps me grounded, out here. Thank you to Kopi, and Dixie and Kat (I feel like Miss Jeannie of romper room, looking through her magic mirror!)... and to all those who have visited the Pen - briefly or otherwise. Fool (feeling particularly warm and fuzzy on this Thanksgiving Eve)

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 12:53:31 +1100

Um, I believe I said exclusive use so far? And if someone else wanted to join you, you'd have to share? Dangling dark chocolate in front of us in the last week of NaNo is asking for company!

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 12:55:27 +1100

OMG - Romper Room! Miss Jeannie and the mirror!! I remember that show.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 15:33:26 +1100

Besides, it's not Kat's to decide. If we all write yourself into the chimney, you're stuck with us.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Timkford — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 19:31:44 +1100

Ha! So, as I expected Kat is a pedant. And Froggie ... well, we write ourselves, you write yourselves, but we all write youself ??? doesn't feel right to me (does anyone know a pedant?) The way I see it is, you all have your muses that you have created; I created Black Swan Witch; Black Swan Witch lives in the Dark Chocolate room above the chimney - ergo the Dark Choc room is mine. But you can all use the chimney - tha's fair enough (Or is there something in the rules about any stretch of the imagination belongs to the pen once written in there?) It was Erica in the novel / Sally in the field / Sven in the big Volvo truck that started all this!

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kataja — Thu, 24 Nov 2011 21:20:27 +1100

Is the chocolate Fairtrade?

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Timkford — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 01:13:47 +1100

What I am eating at the moment is Fairtrade Ghanaian dark chocolate with spices and orange oil. The room made of dark chocolate above the fire is ..... and there was a bit of a clue there .... (is fictional - sorry!)

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Erica in the novel — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 05:57:00 +1100

Me!?!? Whad I do? I'm just a silly newbie wandering about...

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 06:11:37 +1100

[quote=Timkford] ... is there something in the rules about any stretch of the imagination belongs to the pen once written in there? [/quote] Nope, not that I know of. So far we don't have any Official Rules. At some point we might need some, though, if folks don't show enough respect for what others have written. We could snag some from the Role Playing thread... [quote=Timkford] Ha! So, as I expected Kat is a pedant. [/quote] Darn. Thought I was being sneaky...

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Timkford — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 20:15:53 +1100

Just in case - please don't take my sarcasm/flippancy/insults seriously - I was only messin above. Do what you like with the DC room, just don't eat all of the chocolate!

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

dancingfool — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 05:00:28 +1100

so -- What am I missing here? Tim asked what I thought was a cute Q about the chimney. Kat had been responding to Qs by others... so she pointed out that he had exclusive use "so far"... so when Tim picks up on the game and tells someone else that Kat said the chimney was his... we end up with this rather snarky comment that it's not Kat's to decide. I'm sorry, I guess I missed the part where chimneys and bouncy couches, and black swan witches, free food and drink, and muses became real, and serious. IT'S A FRICKIN' GAME. To all who thought I truly believed a surge protector would protect me, please accept my apologies for leading you on. Surge protectors only protect electrical things that are plugged into them. I guess I got caught up in the make-believe, and the bizarre and extreme, and the efforts of some, to make many laugh.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 05:37:18 +1100

LOLOLOL, you are so funny! But is that true? :0

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 05:42:41 +1100

Characters belong to the writer. We've always allowed other people to insert them in a scene but you shouldn't go and fundamemtally change them. I did that the first year with one of Trees and she wasn't happy with it. From then on I create my own characters. And under copywriter law they belong to the author,not the site. That is also in the terms of serve of NaNo I believe.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 05:48:33 +1100

You know, I'm really sorry that folks took newbie to be a dirty word. It means, in AMerica "New kid on the block" No idiot, moron or duffus. Just new person learning how to play the game. Once you learn, you're a pro... which does not mean prostitute in this sense.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 06:23:47 +1100

[quote=treefrog5700] Besides, it's not Kat's to decide. [/quote] Nina, be consistent. Just as I can't decide about the chimney, you can't decide about the kitchen! All areas of the Pen are available to writers and their characters for use in story lines. No one is obligated to participate in a story line. Or any story line at all. There can be any number of stories ongoing concurrently. Anyone may join in, but MUST respect the story line laid out by the original author. Respect and politeness have been lacking this year. We're adults and should have mastered those a long time ago.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

benjan — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 06:51:23 +1100

That tone was set at the very beginning, Kat. No one owns the Pen and yet I felt like I was treading on someone else's property. When I finally had all the disrespect I could take, I left. The word 'newbie' should be banned from the Pen. Everyone who enters there should be a 'new friend' and have their ideas respected and included. That didn't happen. If you want a healthy Pen back, then start over each year with new characters and new story ideas and allow new ideas to flourish.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 07:03:19 +1100

Newbie is a classic NaNo term (used elsewhere as well; not invented here). There's even a section of the forums devoted to newbies. Sorry if it sits wrong with you. Geezer sits wrong with some folks, too. Can't please everyone. You are welcome to start any story line you like. Anyone can. There is no obligation to follow what Dixie or I or anyone else may do. But you also can't pull people into your story who haven't indicated a willingness to be there. At one point this year a bunch of you went into the cellar. I specifically did NOT go so you all could develop a story line of your own. What happened with that? The Pen has always built on what happened in previous years. We don't start from square one every time. Please re-read Kopi's opening post. You are free to begin your own traditions and characters. As we all did.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 07:14:26 +1100

[quote=benjan] No one owns the Pen [/quote] Many of us view Kopi as the proprietor of the Pen. She is the creator and the one who "opens" it each year.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 07:53:11 +1100

I just posted a public apology which has resulted in an argumentative response! I suggest everyone go read the Role Playing rules set up in the Role Playing forum. They're set up by the moderators. The Pen is a role playing forum. Newbie is not obscene in any respect nor is it an abusive word. It was never meant as an insult and I've said that, ad naseum. If banning words is your thing do so. I'm sort of against banning free speech particularly when there is no intent to harm or offend. How a person decides to take something is beyond my control and I accept no responsibility for faulty thinking. The pen is fiction...if you are taking the writing as personal, then role playing may not be a good choice for you. I don't have to play YOUR story line. You don't have to play MINE. No one stopped anyone from playing any story line. I certainly never played off anything you wrote. If your idea of inclusion is forcing me to play lines I don't have an interest in, you do not understand the concept of a role playing forum. Again, the rules are posted on the Role playing forum. Follow them. At no point has anyone ever dictated how the Pen was played. Until now. But since you now Occupy it, you can do whatever you like. No one is going to bother you in the least. I've certainly have no intention of returning to the thread. I write well enough that I can entertain myself quite well elsewhere. So you don't even have to deal with me. Unless you want to keep responding to my posts in an argumentative way. That would a waste of your time. Contrary to your perception, the thread was set up by Kopi. All previous players have respectfully viewed it as her thread. She sets the tone. No me, not you. She started this thing years ago. Threads belong to the initiator. Kat started this thread. I respectfully view it as HER thread. If you set a thread up, I'd respectfully view it as your thread. You do not have the right to hijack anyone's thread. Initiators can request that a thread be locked out. Again read the Role playing rules. And follow them. The appropriate etiquette for addressing a personal problem with an individual is to email them directly and respectfully question them on it. It is very rude to address a forum en mass with perceived offenses that they may not have intended. Before you beat someone up, it is courtesy to see if they were actually throwing a punch at you. If your response is not responded to that is what the moderators are for. I know they're happy to look into any complaints.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 08:03:17 +1100

I'm going write my novel. This debate, as far as I'm concerned, is over. Anymore complaints should be addressed as stated in the forum rules.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

benjan — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 08:24:35 +1100

Wow. You know, Dixie, whether you see this or not, your post about newbies made me smile. Funny thing is, you went off on me, but I wasn't responding to you. I was responding to Kat's comment about respect. I just spent half an hour carefully constructing an answer to her post that wouldn't further inflame the situation, since up till now, I have been silent. There's no point in posting it. Likewise, I am done with this. I wish you well.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dragonchilde — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 09:27:18 +1100

I just wanted to clarify something; the appropriate term here is thread. :) The Pen is not a forum, it's a thread within a forum. The Roleplaying forum is a forum. :) Just to be clear; if posts are clearing trolling or disruptive, we may remove them, or ask that they stop, but someone just jumping in with an on-topic (ish) storyline is welcome to do so. No one may be excluded from any roleplaying threads; this will be more clear when I move this thread over there shortly. You are not required to respond or participate in any storyline; if you aren't happy with a post, feel free to ignore it. The nature of a game like this is that no single person can control every aspect of it; any D&D Dungeonmaster will tell you that the players never do what you want, and it's not worth it to try. The best games are the ones that have a loose set of guidelines, where people may play and have fun. While thread creators may indeed request a thread be locked, it is unlikely that we will do so unless it is an active violation of our rules. If you have any further questions or complaints, feel free to ask me.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 12:26:46 +1100

I didn't decide about the kitchen. I created a character who went ballistic when people who weren't employees went into his kitchen. As part of the ongoing story, he should have shoved Simon out of the kitchen and in my post, he did. It was never meant to be serious. They aren't real. But the fact that my posts were totally ignored was real. Even so, I attempted to keep Simon in character. I thought I did but clearly I didn't. I wasn't trying to set off a firestorm. My apologies. We apparently were not on the same page. I'd like to get there.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 12:30:43 +1100

Yikes.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 14:22:46 +1100

Kat, I apologize for being snarky. None of us make the rules but I shouldn't have said that. It was rude. Dixie, I'd like to reconcile but I suspect you won't read this, which is a shame. My Occupy post fit well with the theme of giving the story back to all the writers so I used it as such, but I had been planning it before any of this went down. Kopi wanted to attend Occupy and couldn't. I felt like I could write a realistic version and present it to her at the Pen. It is not a political statement and was not intended to offend anyone or push anyone out. I haven't looked at the role playing guidelines. It may be true that you don't have to let other people in your storyline or use theirs but I don't get it. Why would you go to a role playing site if you didn't want to play?

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

dancingfool — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 16:39:14 +1100

benjan....I'm not going to go back and re-read the posts, but I am astonished at what you've written here. So first, if I was one of those who you felt disrespected you, please accept my sincere apologies. To my knowledge, I have never shown anyone disrespect. I do know that I have used the word newbie -- I've used it in regard to myself. Frankly, I like newbie far better than I like geezer or crone. And, no disrespect intended... I'm not really interested in either having, or being called a 'new friend'. Next, I'm not aware of anyone else showing you anything that I would consider disrespect... heck, when your computer died, we even kept a place for you on the bouncy couch.... I'm not sure what else you could have asked from us. And if I recall correctly, when I was littering the Pen with lost and found items (from the best lines thread), I included some of your stuff. I don't know if you read any of the Pens from the previous year, I see this is your first year on nano... at least with this name. If not for the fact that I have to believe YOU don't mean any offense or disrespect, I would be offended at your suggestion that the Pen is not healthy, and that the way it's been done (and done well) for the past bunch of years is wrong, because it's not what you want. If you were not happy with what happens to your story ideas and characters in the Pen -- or anywhere else, you are always free to create your own thread, of course... and perhaps you might find you had an even larger following than the Pen has had. But again, I'm assuming you meant no disrespect to those of us who were happy with how things were, and were trying to change things for the better... perhaps your good intentions, were a little misplaced. Congrats on your purple ribbon, and I wish you much happiness in whichever threads you choose to frequent in the future.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 18:17:37 +1100

The Pen isn't really a game, it's a NaNo support group for people around or over 50. We don't use the RPG rules because we are ourselves in the Pen. Serge was created to give people a neutral character to talk to while they got their feet - a mirror person reflecting back what they projected into him - except he was the perfect barkeeper because he always knew what you wanted to drink (originally his name was Sergei, but somewhere, he lost the "i"). At least, that's the way I've always seen it - and we just goofed around in there, with evil muses, inner editors, and plot bunnies making for interesting time while we waited for NaNo to start, and to ask questions and all. I think, this year, a lot of the younger people thought the Pen was an RPG and started treating it that way.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 18:28:42 +1100

I don't really own the Pen. I just set it up every year (except once) so we have a place that's comfy and relaxed to talk about whatever you'd talk about in a friendly neighborhood bar, playing writerly bar games, and quaffing gallons of virtual beers and wines and coffees and such. It kind of bothers me when someone new to the Pen walks in and immediately says that we hate them or that they aren't welcome there and that someone in the Pen shoved them out. That's not what the Pen is about. I try to redirect that when I notice it. This year, learning to type one handed and not being able to spend as much time on line as I'd like, I haven't always gotten to those posts as quickly as I should have. This year, when I've been on line and at NaNo, the only place I've really gone is the Pen. It never has been an exclusionary RPG game. It may have had elements of playing around (the plot lines of the muses and the inner editors and the plot bunnies), but none of us rolled up characters and no one created any game story that we all participate in. The Pen is a loose coaltion of people over 50 trying to write a novel in 30 days, and the Pen is a release valve for that, a place to trot out plot ideas and see how they run. It's a place to cheer one another on, not tear each other down. That's why the decor matches what's happening in NaNoLand, and the celebrations in the Pen are birthdays and NaNo landmarks.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 18:35:24 +1100

The Pen is not and was never meant to be an RPG thread. There are people who've made subplots of RPG-ness in it, but the Pen was created to be a place where people could pop in to talk about things. Anything. Writing. Life. Muses. Inner editors. And the Pen morphed to be whatever people wanted it to be. I don't think there was ever a time when all of us "played". I know I don't generally "play", I'm not good at online RPGs, so I am always myself there. There have always been a number of tangents and tpoics going on, some RPG and some not. The Pen itself is not an RPG, not originally. I suppose it is, now, and we've thereby lost it because I don't do RPG. If the Pen is going to be RPG, then I'm out.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Erica in the novel — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 03:24:29 +1100

RPG? Rules? I think I was right to wait, watch and try to learn....

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 03:34:22 +1100

"Anyone may join in, but MUST respect the story line laid out by the original author." This was the problem right here. There was only one story one going and I wasn't able to join it. There was no role for me and when I tried anyway, I got blasted with a "Hands off Simon" post that really floored me. The part of my post that needed addressing was that I'd been written out and wanted to use the last week to fix it. As friends. The fact that a virtual chef tossed a virtual spy out of a made-up kitchen is besides the point. I would like to fix this. It's fake, we are real people who happen to be online friends. I enjoy your Multiply posts. This is silly.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dragonchilde — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 03:50:14 +1100

[quote=Kopiluwak] The Pen is not and was never meant to be an RPG thread. There are people who've made subplots of RPG-ness in it, but the Pen was created to be a place where people could pop in to talk about things. Anything. Writing. Life. Muses. Inner editors. And the Pen morphed to be whatever people wanted it to be. I don't think there was ever a time when all of us "played". I know I don't generally "play", I'm not good at online RPGs, so I am always myself there. There have always been a number of tangents and tpoics going on, some RPG and some not. The Pen itself is not an RPG, not originally. I suppose it is, now, and we've thereby lost it because I don't do RPG. If the Pen is going to be RPG, then I'm out. [/quote] Except you have been. ;) I've read over the majority of this thread, and everything I've seen is roleplaying. Sure, there's more of yourselves in it than most people are willing to admit to, but you have characters, storylines, settings... and that's what an RPG is. RPGs don't have to fit in the category of dice or computer graphics to fit; all it takes is imagination and something not resembling reality. Regardless of what it was originally, this is what it is now; because of that, it needs to move. There are no discussions that can take place here that can't take place there; I'm not sure where that thought comes from. The Roleplaying forum is not an all ages forum. As such, there is nothing that can be said here that can't be said there. I'm sorry that many of you are unhappy about this move, but the thread has evolved, and as such, it needs to move. The only thing that changes is the venue. You can talk to the other mod about perhaps having a link to this thread from the welcome thread, so those looking for it know where to find it, but I think its place here really isn't appropriate any more. Because of this, it has now moved. If you would LIKE, I think we can make a compromise and leave the guide here, if you prefer, and link it back from the original thread.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 04:31:24 +1100

I did read it. So I'm glad I came in long enough to do so. Today will be my last day in the 50's forum. My decision is to stay out of all forums from this point on except the help forums if I need help with something. My life is stressful enough without having to watch what I say at ever turn. It's fine, Nina. I was upset with you but I try not to stay upset with people. Life is too short. I think everyone is sorry. People make mistakes. Wish we didn't but we do. We've never had to ask questions about how the Pen worked. This guide was put here to try and explain the setting, characters, and some of the players. I do not think it was taken that way. That's unfortunate because had it been ... well, it doesn't matter. I've said several times that I wrote nothing with an intent to hurt anyone. But it is unreasonable to expect people to participate where they have no interest. I'm not into political issues. I like a particular kind of story. But I don't expect everyone to like that. So I liked watching other people spin their own lines and see where they went without me. It never offended me if I wasn't involved. I got to watch at times. That was fun. Fool is a good example. She stumbles in there and goes in weird directions. She's amazingly funny by it. Surge protectors didn't do a thing for me... but it was hysterically funny. I was watching. That is what the Pen was about... supporting and watching people have fun. The only regret I have it that Kopi was hurt most by this. That is the most unfortunate thing. She's a nice lady who did something special.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

dancingfool — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 04:51:12 +1100

The Pen is dead. Dragonchilde... I understand that you think the thread belongs elsewhere, and I disagree with you. Be that as it may, I acknowledge your power to move it. (By the way, I want to share with all, that Dragonchilde tells me plans were made to move the Pen, long before the foolishness began.) I know I stated several times that this was just a game, but I did not mean a role playing game, I meant that it was not real life. But - in real life, I'm a lawyer, with a husband and two cats. In the Pen, I was a lawyer, with a husband and two cats. True, I briefly had a macaq monkey as a muse, in the Pen, and I don't have one in real life, but that was fiction, not role playing. Nina truly is involved with the Occupy stuff, Kat really has horses, Dixie really is a widow, Benjan really did have computer issues, Tim really does like dark chocolate, and I wouldn't be surprised if Dragon truly plays the ukelele.. or at least some instrument. Among other things, the Pen was a place to share a little piece of our REAL lives, with others of our generation. I will forever miss the Pen. I looked forward to it this year, as much as I looked forward to NaNo. FWIW, I have been a huge supporter of all the changes on the website this year, including the ones I didn't really care for... because overall, it was good. But this is a mistake. Hmmm... perhaps we can create the Bouncy Couch. NOT a place for role playing, but a place to share some real life stuff, and turn some of the not-so-pleasant things into something we can laugh it. I guess the key rule is that we have to make it clear that it's real, in order to avoid being moved.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 05:08:11 +1100

Nina, when I wrote about respecting the story line of the original author I had in mind how Dragon's story of someone trying to kill Dixie was changed to Fool being the target. I guess I should have included the example along with the original statement. If there was only one story line going on it was because no one had started anything else! So many of the complaints have been about a story line people didn't want to join. WHY didn't at least one of the complaining people start a story of their own????

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

benjan — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 06:35:15 +1100

Congratulations to you too, Fool, and thank you for yours. You are correct that you did nothing that felt like disrespect to me. I meant no disrespect by my comments. It was perhaps too broad. I will grant you that I could have worded my comment better as more of the opinion or suggestion that it was meant to be. For that I apologize. I had explained my comment further in another post that hopefully would have led to a clarifying discussion, but it quickly became a moot point. In this post, I agreed with Kat on many of her points. In fact, the newbie thing has been completely blown out of proportion. Believe me if you want to or not, but it's not that big an issue for me. Somehow it all keeps getting dragged back to that. I left the Pen originally for other reasons that I am not willing to go into, but please remember that I am not the only one. Again, I apologize. I wish no ill will towards anyone. Never have. I'm not that way. I am heartsick about this. Please excuse if I choose not to respond to any further comments. I wish you well.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dragonchilde — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 07:00:12 +1100

At this point, I think most people have made their decisions, however, I want to point out one thing: This thread will only die if you let it. If people stop posting, because they don't like the new forum where it is, then we can't exactly force them. Perhaps it would be better elsewhere; maybe it just doesn't fit on the NaNoWriMo forums anymore. I don't think that's true. If you want it to continue, it will; the only way it will die is if you let it, and stop posting. It's your choice, and I respect that. I'm sorry this decision has caused such strife, but I stand by it; while you don't see it as an RPG, because you haven't set up alter "egos" as it were, I and others do. It involves storylines, plots, and characters, even if those characters bear a startling resemblance to your real lives. I do regret that so many of you have opted to sign the death warrant of something you've enjoyed, but know that this is strictly your choice. Nothing else changed but the location of the thread itself.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

dancingfool — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 07:28:47 +1100

Dragonchilde, It's unfortunate that you and the OLL staff believe that nothing has changed but the location, that the change of location is trivial. That's like someone taking my chocolate ice cream and swapping it for chocolate chocolate chip, and then telling me that nothing has changed but the flavor. Before you shake your head and say tsk tsk, hear me out. Yes, it's still ice cream, and yes it's still chocolate .. but it has a slightly different flavor, a different texture, a different feel. Part of what made The Smoking Pen what is was, WAS its location, in the 50+ forum. Sure, it's still a thread, and it still exists in nanoland, and many of the characters might be the same, but changing the location, changes the flavor. I doubt you meant to give us guilt trips, by saying that we have signed the death warrant of something we enjoyed, and I hope that enough people stick around, that the Pen continues. But know this -- by changing the location, you have changed the nature of the Pen. I suppose that might not be bad, but it is most certainly true. Laurie

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 09:08:35 +1100

While I am sad about this and wish it were different, I want to say, on her behalf, that Dragonchilde is just doing her job. She's the moderator and she has to make judgement calls on a lot issues. Have you looked at how many she is covering? Sometimes I suspect the calls are a lot harder than even she would like. But she makes them. I wouldn't want her email box. So, even though I may not be happy at some decision (I still want an edit button?), I appreciate all the hard work that this staff puts forth to make it a place of fun for every person. Their jobs are not always easy. I agree that posting to the Pen is the only way to keep it going. For me, it is already not the Pen but for a different set of reason. However, the link at the top of the guide, I think, is a good thing for those who continue. You can also bookmark the link to your favorites so that you don't have to wade through all those forums to find it. That's what I did for several areas I frequent this year and it save tons of time finding the pages.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 09:14:46 +1100

Kat, that story line is a perfect example of what went wrong. The door exploded because of a misunderstanding, which was funny, and I used it as an opportunity to divert the story to include Fool and me. Great example of how I what I said had no effect. Dragon could have been mistaken. An assassin could be after both people. But I wasn't invited in. I assume that exclusivity wasn't intended, but that's what was. You guys were the only ones left and you were a closed group. I was appalled when Dixie jumped my case over a character when I had just stated that I had been written out and wanted to fix it. I suspect she was shooting from the hip, didn't think. I'd like to think that anyway. But I'm a person who admitted to feeling left out and she shot back about how I couldn't even talk to her character. Good Lord. I offered to reconcile with Dixie, even though I would like an apology. I think the biggest thing we can all learn from this is that we can't see straight when we're defending ourselves. Or characters. Most of all, I think we should all look at conflicts from the other person's view. If someone takes offense at something, it may be because it came across as offensive. When they say so, don't be so quick to defend. Listen. All of us.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

deddragoninn — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 09:42:52 +1100

Um...which is exactly why I posted after I had scoured the entire thread (all 35 pages of it or so) and built the case that it was you attacking Fool (based off of previous comments from your posts). Personally, I thought being the villain would be fun, but you could have argued it was a set up. You chose to do neither. And that's fine too, but I didn't ignore what you were posting, nor did I (or have I ever) considered what I was doing part of a closed group.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 09:46:17 +1100

Fool, I was just over there. It's no different. This is something we built in our minds. It may have been a different situation if the move was done several weeks ago but at this point, I doubt it will be overrun with other people. And if a few drop in. let's welcome them. They may have something good to add.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 10:04:35 +1100

It's not the type of people who might drop in and use it, or even the fear that it will change (much), it's the fact that the Smoking Pen is predominantly a place for people over 50 to find and use, and not many people over 50 will go to the RPG forum, so they won't be as likely to find it. We'll become invisible to the very people the Smoking Pen is meant for.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 11:02:04 +1100

Wow. I never even saw it. I would have played the villain. Where was it?

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

deddragoninn — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 11:06:47 +1100

Page 37, towards the bottom of the page, right after your post about the monkeys.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 11:14:57 +1100

Depends on how you had your view set up. Turns out I had nested view turned on and was missing posts by scrolling to the end. If this whole mess is anyone's fault, it's mine, both for not thinking we needed any rules and for not realizing people thought the Pen was an RPG instead of a place that was part support group, part place to anthropomorphize our writing anxieties, part place to trot out and test story ideas. I just assumed we'd all be adults here and if something weird was going on, we'd use the NaNoMail before getting upset. I was wrong. Mea culpa. Mea maxima culpa.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 11:15:16 +1100

Just found it. Might be a nested/flat thing. Or I might have gone on when there were lots of posts to catch up on and just skimmed and missed it. More likely that. I'm amused. Appreciate the effort.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

dancingfool — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 13:14:57 +1100

Tree, I agree with you, that - for this year, it will make no difference. My recollection was that, last year, as NaNo wound down, and people got their purple, they stopped in -- people we hadn't seen since the first of the month, and people we hadn't seen at all... and again, I agree with you... come on in, people, the water's fine. And hopefully they'll like it well enough, that they'll arrive a bit earlier next year. Because the problem, as I see it, will be next year. I could well be mistaken --- I hope I am mistaken. But I fear that, with the exception of those of us who know where the Pen is hidden, few if any of the 50+ crowd, will wander in. I don't think there are a lot of 50+ers who will choose to wander into the Outside the Box category, and select the Role Playing and Communal Story Building forum, and then select The Smoking Pen thread... which isn't stickied, and isn't tagged as a 50+ group. Until today, I've never been in the RPG forum. So the outcome will be fewer newbies, rather than more. I guess maybe that puts the burden on those of us who do know about the Pen, to actively recruit and invite 50+ers next year, so that they come find us.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 14:18:38 +1100

Fool, I think you're right about next year. If the Pen is opened next year, we should be able to post the link in a thread in the 50+ section. It would be an extra click for folks to get there, and you wouldn't be able to see if there were new posts or not, but at least they/we could get there. Dixie's idea of adding it to favorites is good, too, but that's an individual choice.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 14:51:06 +1100

It is listed as a 50+ thread in the RPG forum. Not to say that it will be next year but it is right now.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Tue, 29 Nov 2011 01:06:09 +1100

It will depend on what it's named. Next year, instead of just calling it the Smoking Pen, we could name it "Age Group 50+ - The Smoking Pen". That might upset some of the younger folk, but it would be an honest name.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Tue, 29 Nov 2011 02:30:41 +1100

Actually, that'd be a good idea, Kopi. All that people would need to do then is bookmark it as a favorite on their toolbar and it would take them right to it any time.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

dancingfool — Tue, 29 Nov 2011 03:33:32 +1100

IF anyone cares (well, actually, even if they don't).. as of 11AM, EST, Nov. 28th, there have been 29 different contributors to the Pen... as well as a small group who posted here (in the guide), indicating that they stopped by and looked through the window, but didn't jump in.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Tue, 29 Nov 2011 08:59:17 +1100

That's pretty interesting. And probably about average for the last few years. I had heard rumors that people come in to read just for the fun of it. Would have been nice if they commented when they were there so we could see that they were there. The first year I believe Kopi counted 49 or forty something. It fell off after that when many of those writers didn't return to NaNo. I have many of them on my list and they don't even have word count bars indicating they weren't here at the transition. Others have bars and no word counts. Good job, Fool.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Tue, 29 Nov 2011 09:17:47 +1100

We usually have about 30 or so people writing in the Bar, and who knows how many who stop by to read it without commenting or contributing. The past couple of years, people have come in because they say they are finally old enough to be there, that they'd heard about the Bar elsewhere, kind of a micro-famous.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Tue, 29 Nov 2011 13:08:29 +1100

That's what I heard too. Chris is one of those.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Wed, 30 Nov 2011 12:27:17 +1100

Woape, Keme, and Miguel are getting the Pen ready for the TGIO Party.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Wed, 30 Nov 2011 13:45:18 +1100

I'm not sure she's 50 yet. I wasn't when I first showed up in the Pen. Being in the 40s group didn't make sense for me at that point. It was mostly people who were balancing writing, jobs, kids schedules, school stuff. I had a job but I was an empty nester so I fit better on the Geezer forum. I'm mostly posting the bump the thread up but I thought I'd throw that in..

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:32:47 +1100

Me too!

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Erica in the novel — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 02:35:43 +1100

What's a TGIO Party? I would like to come, now that I am no longer frantically writing.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 02:49:16 +1100

Every year, Kopi throws a TGIO party in the Pen. Everyone is welcome. Just get you some fancy duds and show up! Anytime between midnight tonight and midnight tomorrow night. Last 24 hours.LOL, so all time zones can pop in.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 06:07:02 +1100

"The TGIO Party starts in 5 1/2 hours!" Woape dashed down the length of the Pen artfully scattering pouches of purple confetti. "You need to scrub down the buffet - Keme has some awesome food to set out. And may sure you change the covers to the purple ones with little crowny points that say WINNERS on them. Everyone here is a winner even if they didn't get purplded this year." "Slow down, Woape," Serge laughed. "Five hours is plenty of time to get things done." "I have to hang the banners, too!" "Round up the Lost Pool Boys and set them to doing that." That startled a laugh out of Woape. "Those topless young men are more likely to pose than post. Have you seen them off in the game room, showing off their pecs ad bis?" "And I still have to decorate the Pen over at Facebook!" she wailed Willis pointed to the mirrors behind the bar. "Everything you do here is reflected there." "Oh! Phew! That cuts my work in half - and my panic."

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 07:45:24 +1100

Bump

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Dixiegirl — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:55:48 +1100

Bump. so funny.. why not just put a link on the forum itself?

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Erica in the novel — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:59:53 +1100

Cool! I would love to, but ... where is the Pen now. i don't see it where I used...

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 10:06:57 +1100

On the first page of this thread, in the very first entry, there's a link. (Thank you, Dragonchilde, for that.) It's in the role-playing section of the forums now instead of here.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 12:31:26 +1100

Well, let's see if this works this time instead of telling me something went wrong. The TGIO Party is now underway at both the new NaNo location for the Pen and at the new year round FB location. It's dress as you like (but please, do dress), with lots of cheering and camaraderie and some commiseration - but we old people tend to go purple more often than the other age groups. I like to think it's because we're more dedicated, because we certainly don't have more time!

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Generalist — Fri, 02 Dec 2011 05:39:09 +1100

Ah, somebody else who doesn't watch TV.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Fri, 02 Dec 2011 09:34:59 +1100

I did. Dragonchilde moved to the Guide.

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kat Gentian — Fri, 02 Dec 2011 13:59:17 +1100

There's just too much else to do!!!

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

Kopiluwak — Sat, 03 Dec 2011 12:07:53 +1100

We're not really an RPG and we don't have any real rules at the Pen, just to be nice and not mess with other people's muses, inner editors, or test characters. *Everyone* is welcome at the Pen, even if they're not over 50 yet. Serge will bring you a drink and Keme a snack or meal - whatever you want. And the people in the Pen are friendly and helpful. All those people who write that they have to sneak in or aren't welcome are really just shy because we don't feel that way at all. No one has to join in on any of the foolery going on, either and are welcome to start some storylines of their own, if they want. I'm not very good at interactive storytelling. The best I can do is write about myself in the third person!

Re: Guide to The Smoking Pen Bar and Grill

treefrog5700 — Mon, 05 Dec 2011 01:49:46 +1100

I rarely watch TV either. If I'm going to sit still, I prefer to read or write.