Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Alaskan_Adventurer — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 04:25:03 +0000

I am one of those odd preppers/survivalist type of people and I am considering implementing it into my novel. My idea so far is a city that is being overrun, and magic doesn't work safely here, so it is only used in the most dire of circumstances. This section of my novel will actually jump into the thriller genre until he is able to escape, since my mc will basically be unarmed and will need to rely on his wits to get him out. The majority of my novel, which is like 80%, is true fantasy. I feel adding this section in will give my story a bit more realism, especially in our current times. Do you feel this would work? Why or why not? Thanks

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Kayla Rain — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 05:37:27 +0000

Anything can work if you write it well ;) But I think survival themes are present in almost every fantasy novel, just how hardcore is the difference. I, personally, like things like this, and I agree on the realism thing. It will defintely make your novel more three-dimensional. :) Also, the survivalism and all that could really help readers to get to know the characters better by how he/she react to situations and how to respond (e.i. choosing the obvious choice and acting quickly, or taking time to think things out, and all that.)

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Dav1d — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 06:38:52 +0000

As one of those odd hard core preppers/survivalist types, I've got to say survivalism has got nothing to do with fantasy. I mean when you can dream up a spell to get you out os a situation it's got nothing to do with survivalism, in my opinion. Nor would in my opinion a true hard core survivalist see himself as unarmed, his/her greatest weapon will always be their knowledge. There is a real limit to the amount of amo that one can carry. Real survivalist know how to turn the innocent into a weapon, it's NOT about having the biggest gun! So we don't label our novel a fantasy survivalist novel! To incorporate the concepts seems reasonable, to me that means your character never complains about not having his guns/knives whatever. That he takes common things that are not thought of as weapons and uses them effectively as weapons. That he/she doesn't fall into despair. Perhaps he's used foresight and has a few useful things stashed away, that he comes across on his way out? To me Survivalism is about a mindset far more than about what toys you are bringing to the party. About how one looks at things, and ones place in life. It's about practical knowledge, things one has mastered and knows how to do today. As much as it is about not drawing attention to ones self. Not giving the world a reason to notice you...

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Kayla Rain — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 17:47:05 +0000

Oh... well the fantasy I've been reading lately is mostly low-key, and mainly centered around mortal humans with really no special abilities, so that's where I got the survivalism thing from, :P

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

keolah — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 18:10:19 +0000

What is "true fantasy"? Is there such a thing as "fake fantasy"? Would that be something like Alice in Wonderland, where the fantasy elements are "just a dream"? O.o And "fantasy" doesn't just mean "dragons and wizards throwing fireballs all over the place"! Even if you have a city "where magic doesn't work right", that's still very much fantasy... Why? Because magic exists in the world, for an obvious starter. It doesn't suddenly leap into another genre just because this area works differently.

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Alaskan_Adventurer — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 18:37:51 +0000

No, not Alice in Wonderland style. It is good vs evil to an extent but due to a few skills i have, some survivalism will be tossed in. There is magic, but my magic system has rules and definite limitations. As far as races are concerned, I don't have the traditional elves, dwarves etc. All my races are unique, with some basic elements of the traditional races. Example, my mc race is known as the Kardai and they are nature oriented. Seeds, herbs and various parts of plants and trees are used as reagents for magic. My magic system is called Naturalism. They gain energy from nature itself, and magic is weakened while in cities and being further away from nature. They despise swords, and most bulky weapons but use a form of martial arts using claws. The worship a god of beasts, and as of now he is still unnamed. They are cunning and are greatly feared, though they are not warmongers. As a rite of manhood, the Kardai are sent out on a spiritual quest to collect a type of sap from a great tree. Getting to this tree is half the battle and surviving the tests in very difficult and the majority of youg men do not return. If the young man survives, he is able to retrieve some of this sap. The sap is crafted into a form of jewelry, or a type of trinket and is what grants the magical powers. While in possession of this trinket, the young man ages at a reduced rate. It is a double edged sword though, and if the item is lost or destroyed, the wearer gains the years back almost instantly. Kardai have been know to quickly disintigrate to dust at the loss of their trinket. For this reason, the items are cherished and protected at all costs. Currently, I am still putting all the history, language and cultures together for my various races. I am also working on drawing out my maps for all the main cities, in hope that this will put a lot of my battle scenes together more precisely. I do have many ideas for my magic/spirit system and religion is also very important. I consider my novel to be quite epic. You have good vs evil and then you have a force with no empathy which are destroying both sides. The force is a huge mystery and it is the basis of my novels. Uniting both the good and evil factions in the world, and figuring out exactly what this seemingly mysterious force is and how to handle it. The Kardai are know for their survival, due to the rite of manhood they must live through. Specific rules must be obeyed. The most important rule involves starting the initiation with no equipment accept for their claws. No food, water or even clothing. They must gather food, water and make their own shelter. Any hides of beasts that are slain will be kept and special clothing will be crafted out of these hides. They revere nature as a race and are known as the protectors of forests.

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Alaskan_Adventurer — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 18:39:33 +0000

Thanks for all your posts and great ideas and advice!

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Dav1d — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 01:06:58 +0000

I wrote this earlier today. I'm not sure if you will or will not find it helpful. Feel free to ignore it, if you don't find it helpful. At some point writing becomes more than simply throwing two words together. At some point it becomes about crafting a world that is believable. When it comes to creating races, we need to be aware of how our choices that we make for them effect them? Just what makes a young male Kardai, believe he is going to beat the odds, and embark on your quest for manhood? Right off you've killed over half of your male population, I suggest that you think about the consequences of that action? The ratio of males to females gets messed with, does each male take three wives, or perhaps four? Some children will be lost while growing up, more will be lost in training for their quest. That would logically leave you with a group of young men who believe they are hot stuff, they are special, arrogant young men who know they beat the odds. Risk takers who are rewarded for taking risk... What some might label as hot heads, the slow hesitant ones are likely to have, either refused to go on the quest, and as such are devalued, or died on the quest, as their fears force them to make bad choices... In my opinion you got a race geared to be hot heads, warmongers, who you claim aren't... Are the Kardai evil? Are they seen as evil? If not then why are they feared, rather than say respected? You've given your Kardai claws, but that is a close in combat skill. They are at a disadvantage to any race that takes a more realistic look at combat, say a race that values longbows and mounted troops. Longbow men can rain down arrows on your Kardai, and take out a significant amount of them, before they ever get close enough for their claws to become effective! You say they don't respect swords, but a sword allows one to keep their opponent at a distance, and prevents them from closing in. Haven't you created a race where all one needs to do is reach out and rip off their trinket and they are as good as dead? Some might find that transistion amusing, and enjoy seeing it. You've set the Kardai up to be dislike by other races, in a number of ways in my opinion. They most likely have more women, than other races, (with over half their males kill before they ever reach adulthood ~ and what values will that teach your race about the value of Kardai life? Or any other races life?) with men often having multiple wives, something that females in my experience find distasteful, and undesirable. You've created a race where there will be too many females, and so females become of less worth than males

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Alaskan_Adventurer — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 01:41:36 +0000

Actually, you are right. Their are less men overall. The race in general has a low population compared to most other races. They are both feared and respected. No, the race doesn't practice polygamy. The women are also respected. They also have a specific trial, though it is more spiritual in nature. I am Still putting together the details of the women's initiation, but it is similar in the rate of morality. The trials of Anagor(name of the tree spirit), is a trial to determine if you are worthy of existing. Failure means death. This is a very hard race. It is not a matter of just ripping the pendant off and the Kardai perishes. A ritual must be undertaken and it is not a task to be taken lightly. For this reason these items are heavily protected and cherished. It allows communication with Anagor and grants most of the Kardai's power. The race is exceptionally hardy, and not easily defeated. They are not warmongers in a sense. If you do something towards their forest or jungle, expect to be hunted down and erradicated. Otherwise, they will not seek trouble. In this sense they are neither good, or evil. There are exceptions of course, like the rogues I have planned. They are a very agile race, and the claws combined with Muay Thai style martial arts is their main attack. They also have the fairly limited magic. I have special equipment called Armaments of Anagor which includes Dew Claws(boots), elbow pads, which basically change your skin to stone and knee pads. All three pieces combined make the Kardai an exceptionally feared race IN combat. Besides magic, they have no real long ranged form of combat because that simply isn't their style. They use stealth, cunning and agility to quickly take out their opponents. The elders are basically pure magi and have a much stronger form of nature magic. The females will also have the ability do almost everything the males do, but are often of higher intelligence due to their style of initiation and they are generally more magic oriented as well. The best warriors are generally males though due to their extreme initiation, but of course their are exceptions. This race is fairly ancient with lots of rich history. I guess you can compare them to the elves in that reguard. A very long lived race due to their magic. Hope this clears things up a bit. Thanks for the advice.

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Dav1d — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 02:57:15 +0000

So continuing to play the devil's advocate here, and try to poke holes in things ~ with the understanding that builds a better story... They live in a forest, and worship a tree... A forest is a relem loaded with life, so just how do you go about killing off over 50% of the young men? Native Americans sent their young on a spirit quest into the desert where there are a plenitude of ways to perish.... I get that you are sending them naked into the world.... But what world? The forest, the world they have grown up in and lived in all their lives? You said they worship nature, but do they demonstrate this worship of nature by going out into the world and killing nature? Do they kill to earn their claws from the animal they beat bare handed? I can envision a world where they go into the world on their quest and must find their animal brother(?), that the quest is both about finding and bonding to their animal brother. That some fail to find this spirit brother and thus fail in their quest this way... To my mind you've got to create an acceptable means for over half of the young men to die... It can't be that over half of them simply don't know what their God wants.... What happens if an outsider finds a trinket? Say one of your Kardai dies, and someone comes across the body and takes the trinket? I think you need a means of getting outside blood into the race... New ideas to stir the pot... I think your biggest issue here is that 50% kill off. It's going to act as a biological filter, and over time give the race a certain mindset, outlook on life, certain characteristics ... Logically over time as the race comes to be more and more like the filtered type, more of them will past the test. Unless the test is truly random, and doesn't filter for anything at all. Wouldn't that result in them not valuing life? I'm not sure at all, that creates a believable environment where the race doesn't value their own children, but worships and values nature. If at some level if I don't value my own child's life, why should I care for any other member of my clans life? Let alone value or respect the the life of another race? By the way that you have thought of a way to turn their skin to armor is a great means to counter those who would deploy stand off weapons.... :) Good Luck..

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Alaskan_Adventurer — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 03:45:02 +0000

Hmm, maybe barkskin. A magic created from rubbing a natural form of paint over your body. It could also be a form of camoflauge. Thanks for the idea. When a Kardai perishes, his body will quickly decay including the amulet. If he dies in his natural habitat, the jungle or forest, vines will quickly engulf the body and it will sink into the earth. The jungle is a very dangerous plan in Equestra. Survival is difficult and like in the theory of Darwinism, survival of the fittest reins supreme in Equestra as well. In a rainforest environment, survival is very difficult and all plants must learn to co-exist or perish. In regards to the Kardai, I am thinking more of a jungle/rainforest environment over a woodland forest. In real life I have spent weeks alone in the rainforests here in Ecuador. Having first hand experience is very helpful in this regard and gives me numerous ideas. A poor soul who doesn't survive the trial is condemned by his/her family and they act as if the person never even existed. It is the nature of the hardness of the race and guarantees strength. One factor I am still considering is the claws. Maybe one of the tasks is having to slay a beast and the claws are later enchanted using the sap of the tree? It would make a bit more sense this way, i guess. I will have to think on that one. Again, thanks for taking the time to play Devil's advocate. It is greatly appreciated.

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Dav1d — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 11:36:10 +0000

[quote=Alaskan_Adventurer] The jungle is a very dangerous plan in Equestra. Survival is difficult and like in the theory of Darwinism, survival of the fittest reins supreme in Equestra as well. In a rainforest environment, survival is very difficult and all plants must learn to co-exist or perish. In regards to the Kardai, I am thinking more of a jungle/rainforest environment over a woodland forest. In real life I have spent weeks alone in the rainforests here in Ecuador. Having first hand experience is very helpful in this regard and gives me numerous ideas. [/quote] It seems to me that you are missing the point here. Yes the jungle is a very dangerous place, and if you are a Gringo going into the jungle on your own and wandering around might well be a death sentence, but if you grow up in the jungle, the the jungle is your home... The kids that don't listen die young. The kids that can stop from turning over rocks, quickly turn over one with a snake under it and get bit.... Yes there are lots of ways to die in the jungle, and those that can not learn how to be safe die young..... But at some point you master the jungle, the jungle becomes your home, you learn how to move around in it safely.... I would contend you do that long before reaching adulthood. So you've got this group of kids that have learn how to travel in the jungle, how to move, what to watch out for, what not to touch, what to not eat, how not to be eaten.... And you put them into their home environment, and suddenly they no longer know how to live? That's what you want me to believe? In my environment the expressway is a very dangerous place to play! Little kids that don't master that concept die young. Little jimmy who lives on one side of the expressway and goes to school on the other side, soon learns how to cross the expressway safely , or soon dies. Once this skill is mastered its not suddenly forgotten upon turning 18.... I believe your Kardai have this same reality, mommy and daddy are not going to strap their 13 and 14 year old kids to their back and never let them move in the jungle on their own. Those kids are going to grow up in the jungle, with the jungle, and they are going to master it young. At some point well before adulthood mommy and daddy are going to set the baby down on the jungle floor and teach him/her how to move. If for no other reason than mommy and daddy need their hands free to stay alive. [quote=Alaskan_Adventurer] One factor I am still considering is the claws. Maybe one of the tasks is having to slay a beast and the claws are later enchanted using the sap of the tree? It would make a bit more sense this way, i guess. I will have to think on that one. Again, thanks for taking the time to play Devil's advocate. It is greatly appreciated. [/quote] Seems to me you need to figure out the reason why some bright leader doesn't simply decide okay I've reach the tree, and now I'm going to start a village here, this tree will be the center of my village/very nearby. And so it will be a lot easier for my children to reach the tree, get the sap, and within just a few years I'll have the bigger army, be the strongest, most powerful chief/leader in this land, and I'll get my pick of what ever are the things the Kardai value. I keep coming back to what makes a parent, willing to sacrifice their children, what is the payoff, what is the reward. I know, you are saying its tradition, it's their value system, it's their way of life.... I've been a parent, I know what that feels like. And yes I also know people who couldn't care less about their children. In my experience the ones who couldn't care less about their children, are out for one thing only, themselves. Those kind of people aren't dependable, aren't someone I would want guarding my back. They are not team players. I find the whole idea of a society that doesn't place a high value on its children growing into a strong society kind of far fetched, unbelievable, I think it takes away from the story... On the one hand I want to know more, it's a good hook to draw me in. But when I don't get an acceptable answer, then it just takes something away, and turns me off, and leaves me disappointed... I wish you the best of luck in the future.

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Alaskan_Adventurer — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 13:48:53 +0000

Aww, I understand. Once the trial starts, the young man has a very clear picture on the direction he has to head. Keep in mind they are supposed to go very deep into the jungle to get to this tree. As a child/teen, they are not allowed to head anywhere even remotely close to the proving grounds and the reader will be clearly aware of this. In the real jungle, miles around the village is generally danger free. So you have your village with heavily beaten trails miles around. Eventually these well beaten trails start to fade and wildlife becomes more commonplace. Many miles later you are in the full splendor of nature once again and it starts to get dangerous at this point. This and beyond is where the young man needs to head. The only time some of the Kardai might head this distance is for the trial, and very occasional group hunts. Never alone. Now you have a situation where the young man will be heading in alone, poorly equipped and must survive on his skills and will to live. Does this make sense?

Re: Concept of adding survivalism into my novel.

Alaskan_Adventurer — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 13:56:27 +0000

It is both culture and religion. Consider the trials a form of sacrifice to cull the weak. Those whom survive are the exceptional. The Kardai feel the risk of dying is worth the power they obtain from direct involvement with their god. Many tribes on Earth very frequently sacrifice innocents just to keep their god/s satiated. Religion is a very powerful motivator, as history on Earth also proves.