Is Steam Punk a Genre? Why or Why Not? http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842 Mae 13 I've seen a lot of people around here saying that steam punk isn't technically its own genre. So, here's my question for all you Wrimos, why isn't steam punk a genre? I am writing a departure from my typical YA fiction this year, and thus far, I would consider it steam punk. Is that technically wrong? I have long enjoyed the "genre" of steam punk, and I'm not sure how else to classify it. I've seen people say that it should be classified under fantasy or sci-fi, but I would argue that it's neither, as it is not characterized with magic and dragons, or futurism and technology. Help me solve this quandary! thanks very much! Sat, 15 Oct 2011 01:28:42 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_66908 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_66908 The_Halla A "genre" is a very hard thing to pin down, and in practice means little more than what shelf your book ends up on in Barnes and Noble. (It's a little more complicated--and consequential--than that, but you get my point; genre tends to be fairly arbitrary.) I'd describe steampunk as an "aesthetic" rather than a genre--it's a set of stylistic and functional conventions, a look and a storytelling style and some thematic norms. In this sense, it's akin to something like Regency Romance, Noir, Modernism, or Beat. It doesn't necessarily even need to be "speculative"--a historically-accurate novel set during the height of the industrial revolution with an emphasis on the technological advances of the era and the right stylistic flair could potentially fit into Steampunk. Sat, 15 Oct 2011 01:52:00 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_67063 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_67063 Notkieran Possibly the answer is "not yet", the same way that "paranormal romance" didn't use to be. Sat, 15 Oct 2011 01:55:05 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_67083 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_67083 Doodger I'd say its a setting; you could have a romantic comedy in it, a drama... It's like if a story is set in the future, it's not always sciencefiction. Sat, 15 Oct 2011 03:11:13 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_67466 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_67466 spirograffe Personally, I see like, family trees of genre. Steampunk and fantasy are both the offspring of sci-fi. And I see sci-fi as any fiction not currently possible in the real world. But that's just me. Sat, 15 Oct 2011 06:58:34 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_68220 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_68220 an-chan Classifying it as scifi makes the most sense to me, because it's taking science and doing fictional things with it, usually. The prototypical sort of steampunk works are all science fiction, like Jules Verne and H.G. Wells and so on. Basically, instead of futuristic technology, you have historistic technology. However, there's steampunk stuff that I'd say would more likely fall in the genre of alternate history, because the technology isn't in a very big role but instead other aspects of a society like that. It's up to the discretion of the writer to put it in whichever category they please. That said, it definitely is a subgenre, and that also definitely makes sense. With genres like scifi or fantasy, you really need the subgenres to give people any kind of idea what you're writing. After all, scifi can range from really hard scifi with actual math in it to space operas where the setting is merely a secondary feature, and fantasy goes all the way from medieval-style high fantasy to urban speculative fiction. So yeah, it makes sense to call steampunk a genre in that sense, because it gives people a better picture of what you're doing, but it also fills the criteria for being scifi. That's why I personally classify it as a subgenre to that, or possibly sometimes alternate history, like I mentioned. Sat, 15 Oct 2011 07:16:48 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_68296 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_68296 ElizaWyatt The problem with not separating out steampunk from everything else, though, is that it really doesn't seem to have anything in common with sci-fi <em>or</em> fantasy, in the practice. Sure, it's speculative fiction with a good shake of historical fiction in most cases... but we have no metal walls with rivets or crawling space suburbs. Steampunk has no dragons or dwarves, swords or castles or space travel (though sure, we can steal anything we want of the above). On average, people who want to talk about steampunk are going for something entirely different than the sorts of topics that come up in the sci-fi or in the fantasy forums; too fantastical to be history, too unscientific for scifi, too much mad science for fantasy. So I'm in favor of splitting them out from the rest. Sun, 16 Oct 2011 16:39:18 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_85971 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_85971 Dreamway Yes. Like "historical," it's a setting. You can have historical domestic drama, historical mystery, historical a/a, historical romance ... but their setting gives them similar problems to solve. Equally, there are steampunk fantasies and steampunk scifi, so since both are steampunk, you can't say steampunk is a subset of scifi only. It would be like making all the writers of historical fiction go to the Romance forum. Sun, 16 Oct 2011 16:49:21 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86115 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86115 Dreamway Huh?! Science fiction is a special subset of fantasy, both artistically and historically. Otherwise, how did people write fantasy for 4500 years before scifi began to be developed? Steampunk exists in both of them, which means it's a subset of fantasy that overlaps scifi. Sun, 16 Oct 2011 16:51:06 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86138 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86138 Dreamway Uh, no, only steampunk scifi has scifi concerns with science. You're totally ignoring the whole area of steampunk fantasy, I suppose because you don't know it exists. Look for Anno Dracula, about how the widowed Queen Victoria weds a Hungarian prince and suddenly fangs are high fashion. That's totally steampunk. Some steampunk fantasy has to do with raising Egyptian gods to drive the British and French out of Egypt (The Anubis Gates) or elvish lords are part of Society, like Irish lords. Victorian wizards proliferate, I assure you. Sun, 16 Oct 2011 16:55:30 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86192 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86192 keolah Assuming that science fiction is only about certain things and fantasy is only about certain other things is taking a quite inaccurately limited view of those genres. Really, when it comes down to it, classifying "genres" is like taxonomy. You have on the one side, "realistic" genres, and on the other side, "fantastic" genres. The "realistic" genres tend to get classified by their plots, while the "fantastic" genres tend to get classified by their settings. The result is that if you have a mystery taking place on a space station, it's going to get shoved under "science fiction" because it's "not real". And the main difference between the various "fantastic" genres is, effectively, the paint scheme. You take your "thing that doesn't exist in real life" and call it magic, and you have fantasy. You paint it over with technobabble and blinkenlights, and you have fantasy. You give it cogs and steam power, and it's steampunk. But when it comes down to it, it still does the same thing. Sun, 16 Oct 2011 16:57:59 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86215 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86215 Dreamway I think there's a point in the sheer anarchy of steampunk. People doing "steampunk scifi" are often purposely violating known science, as in "We know cavorite can't work, but in this world it does." The steampunk fantasy types will build steam golems. The whole area is incredibly loose, and really the science aspects of it are often the weakest. I think most steampunk writers haven't a clue how a steam engine really works. (My DH drove steam locomotives.) Sun, 16 Oct 2011 16:58:15 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86218 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_86218 vampyre_smiles I have to disagree with both of you. Scifi, fantasy and steampunk are all subsets of speculative fiction. And there's a lot of overlap in all three. And personally, I'd say it's a genre in it's own right. Whoever made the mention of having certain genres like romance or mystery set in a steampunk "setting" doesn't seem to realize that the same could be said for fantasy and scifi, which ARE considered genres. Or heck, you could have a book that's both romance and mystery. IT'S CALLED CROSS GENRE, PEOPLE. And most books have at least a major genre and one or two minor ones. Mon, 17 Oct 2011 23:07:11 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_105105 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_105105 Zookeeper I say that steampunk is its own genre. It's not specifically a subset of science fiction, fantasy, horror, mystery, or romance. It can contain elements of any one of them (or more). What is specific to steampunk is the alternate Victorian setting. I spoke up about it in the Suggestions forum but pretty much got shot down. It's never going to get its own forum. I'm going to be writing a zombie novel this year, but last year I wrote a science fiction steampunk novel. Wed, 19 Oct 2011 03:06:23 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_121670 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_121670 Mariana OConnor Steampunk doesn't have to be alternative Victorian... It's the type of technology and atmosphere that defines it, I'd say, not the historical setting. There are steampunk novels set on entirely different planets, with government systems that have nothing to do with the Victorian era, but they're still steampunk. Retribution falls, by Chris Wooding falls into the Steampunk category and it has nothing to do with Earth at all. The society featured in that series of books is more like the society of the golden age of piracy than Victorian society. That's what's so brilliant and yet annoying about writing Steampunk for Nano (which I'm not doing, but I have every intention of doing in the future, if I get a good enough idea) You can tumble into so many different genre lounges and find 'the steampunk issue' being discussed. You get to see half a dozen different genres' perspectives of the one idea but you have no fixed home. Wed, 19 Oct 2011 04:23:54 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_122074 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_122074 Kuroloki I thought steampunk STARTED as a literary genre?? I'm very confused now. What Mariana describes is basically what I thought it was supposed to be. I've been told that the steampunk literary genre doesn't even usually have the aesthetics that the steampunk fashion does, so to say "steampunk is an aesthetic rather than a genre" doesn't make sense. Wed, 19 Oct 2011 19:23:42 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_133053 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_133053 Kuroloki I'm sorry, maybe I shouldn't involve myself because I don't normally talk to other readers and am not familiar with all the terminology. (I tend to dislike "What box does this fit in" discussions anyway, so I don't know why I said anything :( ) Wed, 19 Oct 2011 20:01:29 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_133615 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_133615 Vrihet Thanks for the advice; I looked up how steam engines work and now I am enlightened. :) But I think I liked it better when I had no idea and I could get away with anything. : / Wed, 19 Oct 2011 21:25:01 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_134975 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_134975 crazybooklady I'd say it's become a genre, and those of us who write it understand why it's a genre. But I do get why every genre can't have its own dedicated forum. I think Steampunk should stick here in Other Genres and just resist being shifted elsewhere on general principles. Wed, 19 Oct 2011 22:10:31 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_135724 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_135724 Mariana OConnor Don't apologise. That's what the forums are for. I think the best thing about 'what box does this fit in' discussions is that usually the answer is 'I don't know', 'all of them' or 'none of them', or all three of those answers at once. ^_^ Thu, 20 Oct 2011 02:48:41 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_138360 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_138360 Generalist A good call on SF &amp; F being speculative fiction, along with steampunk. You could say that steampunk is speculative fiction set in a historical setting. In time it will develop its own section in the bookstores and websites. Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:54:26 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_140948 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_140948 Generalist If you consider Jules Verne, H. G. Wells and Mary Shelly to be steampunk, it started as a literary genre long before it got the name steampunk. The name steampunk is a play on words based on cyberpunk. Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:01:07 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_141012 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_141012 keolah At this point, you're lucky if you find fantasy and science fiction on their own shelves, rather than all shoved together into the back corner of the bookstore. ;) Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:05:37 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_141760 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_141760 Goblinmoon so... uhm is Steampunk under 'Other' or under Fantasy for forums? I didn't see any threads for it on here at least. I've been into SP for a long time, and this is not just a jump on the 'hot' wagon thing. Thu, 20 Oct 2011 15:17:52 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_145187 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_145187 keolah There's steampunk threads in fantasy if your particular steampunk has fantasy elements. There's ones in scifi if your steampunk has more scifi elements. And it's not like there's anything preventing you from starting a dedicated steampunk discussion thread in "other genres"... I don't get why people posted threads on "magical realism" and "steampunk" complaining about their "genre-ness" or some such, instead of just posting a discussion thread on them and perhaps including that in the discussion... O.o Thu, 20 Oct 2011 16:38:36 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_146345 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_146345 Phantos Speculative Fiction is a nice genre to encompass a whole bunch of things: sci-fi, fantasy, supernatural horror/mystery, historical AU, and any of the many, many offshoots and subgenres that cover "not quite reality." In other words, steampunk = speculative fiction, and we should probably have a speculative fiction forum. Or not. :) Thu, 20 Oct 2011 16:53:57 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_146604 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_146604 crazybooklady <em> I don't get why people posted threads on "magical realism" and "steampunk" complaining about their "genre-ness" or some such, instead of just posting a discussion thread on them and perhaps including that in the discussion... </em> I think it's because there's been some pushing going on, trying to get people to move their little genre under a specific big one because "that's where it belongs." Hence my earlier assertion that those of us writing something which doesn't fit neatly under one of the big general categories should just stick to Other Genres and (politely!) refuse to move to a category/thread we're uncomfortable with. Thu, 20 Oct 2011 20:16:54 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_149591 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_149591 Squeakerblue As a Steampunk Cosplayer, and Crewmember of an up and coming Steampunk RPG tabletop game, I certainly say that Steampunk is a Genre. It has it's own rules, which, while loose, do have common themes and views. Steampunk doesn't have to be Victorian, Neo-Victorian or even post-apocalyptic, it can even be here and now. I even know some people who have BUILT working machines that use only steam and do much of the same things the electric ones do. (Steam powered sewing machine anyone?) While Steampunk shares some traits with Fantasy and Sci-fi and Romance and too many others to list, that doesn't mean that it's not it's own Genre. Supernatural is it's own, to most people, and it started out as a sub Genre of Fantasy and Sci-fi. Genres form around the Idea, not the other way around. Thu, 20 Oct 2011 23:36:58 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_152280 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_152280 Scaleslea I'll have to vote on the side of Steampunk being its own genre. You could class it as Victorian Sci Fi, but, as others have pointed out, you can easily have a Steampunk story on a world that never knew Queen Victoria. Steampunk is a place where fantasy and technology meet. Everything is new and raw and accessible. You can have a daring scientist, a magic weilding mechanic, secret societies, and arcane wisdom from a lost savage race. About the only thing you can't have is digital technology. Aether power, yes. iPhones? Not so much. Doc Fri, 21 Oct 2011 12:42:07 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_157950 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_157950 crazybooklady lol, can you just imagine how HUGE that forum would be? But you're right, it would encompass pretty much everything. Sat, 22 Oct 2011 02:20:48 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_167231 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_167231 HuskersGirlLaura DOC::: I so agree with you here, since my current running series of novels that i write for NaNo is a steampunk set. I've got airships, powered by aether, on a non-earth world (very sci-fi in basis, according to the "rules"), with a group that does magic but is heavily controlled (fantasy, says the "rules"), and clockwork automatons, and a even an elven country (fantasy). Said world also has, steam ships (like the titanic), and a few steam driven trains. Steam powered carriages, clockwork and weights driven elevators good for only two floors, the very top, and the very bottom (technically, given the technological development of this world, Sci-fi, by the "rules"). Oh, yes, I also have three major romances in the story line, and a who-dun-it that drives most of the plot of one of the books. Go figure. Following this reasoning, where do *I* fit in? I've been having a hard time figuring this out, because I've begun to get to the point where I have 1 and a half novels finished, and am about to blast through the end of one, flesh out the other and write a third. But without using STEAMPUNK as my genre, I have no idea where I would fit in; since I have too many elements of each to fit into the other. On that note, why would I have to get shuffled into that area of the store anyway. Why can't I just go under "GENERAL FICTION" with the rest of the books with too many elements to classify, and just get my own section when I've written enough books to have my own shelf? And this reminds me, following the rules that I'm seeing given here that are against STEAMPUNK being its own genre: Romance needs to be dissolved as a genre. &gt;_&gt; Sat, 22 Oct 2011 12:54:22 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_171496 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_171496 JB Dryden *clears throat* Let us begin with Ronald Clark's "Queen Victoria's Bomb." This is probably one of the first recognizable pieces from what later became known as Steampunk. As a concept, Steampunk began as a particular type of alternate history written in the Hard Science Fiction category. Meaning that the intention was to question science, its ramifications, and its future implications. Only in this particular thread it decided to do so about past -- almost entirely -- incomplete or little known technology. That is typically considered First Wave Steampunk. Thus the original works in the genre are Hard Science Fiction. So yes it was a genre. And a very specific one. However, one must include works like "Morlock Night" and "Anubis Gates" which began to incorporate not only secret history stories but also historical or literary figures. Nearly every piece after this includes someone (Kelvin, Babbage, Edison, etc.). These pieces were more socially-minded than the Hard Science Fiction, but they still fit within the themes that were already being established. After the coining of the term in '87 by Jeter, we have a minor turning point where works within this theme became unified by a single describing term -- one that is admittedly tongue-in-cheek -- as well as becoming a self-realized sub-genre of science fiction. The only two major pieces that came after this that still used traditional Hard Science Fiction themes were "The Difference Engine" (1990) and "Lord Kelvin's Machine" (1992). It is my opinion that later works -- those works after the term was coined -- began to analyze and evaluate those earlier works, scrutinize their tropes, and then manipulate them in such a way as to create a different sort of idea behind them. In this way, Steampunk began to take on the idea of being an aesthetic, rather than a genre. In other words, it began to be placed on top of other genres as a back-drop or setting, much like Noir is. This began the Second Wave of Steampunk. The first of these works were "Anti-Ice" and "The Steampunk Trilogy." It is also after this point that works began to take place in either another world (i.e., secondary world) or in a nondescript "otherworld" (meaning simply that it is set in a sort of no-place). A lot of these were short works in the mid- to late-90's and bleed into the early 2000's. It has been since about the mid-2000's that the genre has taken a very wide-shot approach to things and latched on to the notion of it being an aesthetic, with works like "The Glass Books of the Dream Eaters," "Mainspring," "Boneshaker," and "Court of the Air." All of these are decidedly Steampunk, but they are all very different books with wildly disparate themes. One could even throw in "Perdido Street Station" as pseudo-Steampunk and add even more flavor. The point of all of this is to say that Steampunk is complex. To understand it, one must study it, because it's way more than just airships and goggles and the Victorian age. If the only thing that appeals to you is the fanciful clothes and the gadgets, then you need to reconsider your approach. At its core, and this applies to nearly every piece of Steampunk that I've read (and that list is very long), the genre questions the world around it, especially in regards to the science and technology in that world. Even as Fantasy-feeling as "Court of the Air" is, it still has a sense of technology inquiry; and even as burdened by zombies as "Boneshaker" is, it still questions a particular machine. *takes a deep breath* I'm better now. Sun, 23 Oct 2011 09:41:01 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_182709 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_182709 E.M. Jeanmougin I think I would consider Steampunk a Sub-genre. Like Fantasy Steampunk, Science Steampunk, Horror Steampunk, ect. It may eventually end up as its own genre, but it will probably still be small and contained. Tue, 25 Oct 2011 13:08:17 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_217515 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_217515 tygertyger [quote=Mae 13] I've seen a lot of people around here saying that steam punk isn't technically its own genre.[/quote] I tend to agree with that. I see it as a sub-genre of science fiction, much as space opera, cyberpunk, hard sf and post-apocalypse are. Most of the common tropes of SF are present in steampunk, especially when compared to space opera. You could accurately describe the feel of steampunk by calling it space opera with Victorian tech. Add to this the fact that steampunk draws heavily from the works of Verne and Wells -- both of whom are placed firmly in the SF camp -- and that seals the deal for me. Tue, 01 Nov 2011 10:49:19 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_354491 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_354491 wombatrider I personally would call it "historical fantasy" Wed, 02 Nov 2011 00:49:24 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_380142 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_380142 HuskersGirlLaura @ E.M. Jeanmougin: But that goes back to the notion that if you consider genre like that, then at least one main stream genre needs to go to a corner and die. and to wombatrider: But my steampunk stuff isn't set on earth, so how is it historical? And I am seeing this crop up more and more now as the idea of steampunk takes hold. Wed, 02 Nov 2011 21:35:27 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_413263 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_413263 sky blue Hmmm.... After reading through all the posts, I think ElizaWyatt's sums it up nicely: <em>The problem with not separating out steampunk from everything else, though, is that it really doesn't seem to have anything in common with sci-fi or fantasy, in the practice. Sure, it's speculative fiction with a good shake of historical fiction in most cases... but we have no metal walls with rivets or crawling space suburbs. Steampunk has no dragons or dwarves, swords or castles or space travel (though sure, we can steal anything we want of the above).</em> <em>On average, people who want to talk about steampunk are going for something entirely different than the sorts of topics that come up in the sci-fi or in the fantasy forums; too fantastical to be history, too unscientific for scifi, too much mad science for fantasy. So I'm in favor of splitting them out from the rest.</em> Deciding whether steampunk is a genre or a subset or an aesthetic really speaks to how you individually view those classifications. Meaning, unfortunately, it's totally subjective. However, I don't think a "genre" should be defined by how or how many books are sold in your local big-box-book-store. There is no official genre-naming committee out there, bequeathing titles onto up-and-coming areas of interest. It would be nice to think so, and that's why it's easy to look at marketing to be the deciding factor as to whether it's considered a true "genre" or not...but it's simply not the case. So for me, I do see steampunk as a separate genre because when I describe it to people, I use the term "steampunk" to help illuminate a very set number of things you can expect from my novel which — and this is the important part — you couldn't expect to find in any other fiction classification. At one point, steampunk may have fallen under scifi or fantasy due to its relative obscurity. But it's not that case anymore. Steampunk is everywhere: from fiction to movies to music to cosplay. <em>That's</em> a genre. And never once have I described my YA steampunk novel to someone as a science fiction or fantasy novel. It never crossed my mind. If anything, I clarify the type of steampunk that it is — ya adventure steampunk, much like Alice down a copper-lined rabbithole — so you could say that I am assigning a subset to this genre. I think this may have something to do with conflicting viewpoints on science fiction in the literary world. In the past, Science Fiction was the genre, no exceptions. If you wrote anything outside of romance, historical, humor, biographical, mystery (you may fill in your own sweeping terms), then it was automatically lumped in with Science Fiction. But I think there is so much vibrant growing diversity, the poorly dubbed "Science" Fiction simply doesn't fit any more. I would be more in favor of "Fantasy" but even that is subjective: Isn't all writing that's not based in historical fact merely fantasy? So, back to my original point, I think Steampunk is a genre not in how I view it, but in how I find myself using the term to more accurately describe what I'm writing. There is no other word that fits. Neither Fantasy nor Science Fiction, with all their respective baggage, adequately does the job. I'm writing Steampunk. Thu, 03 Nov 2011 09:09:24 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_426322 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_426322 destinyischoice I agree - it is on it's way to becoming a genre, a bit like Urban Fantasy, and Paranormal Romance, etc. There's a Waterstones in Cambridge (in the UK) that has it's own 'Steampunk' section next to the Sci Fi and Fantasy sections! I'll have to get photo evidence sometime :) Thu, 03 Nov 2011 09:25:08 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_426738 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_426738 HuskersGirlLaura .... I'd forgotten about that. When I tell people what I've been writing, it's normally announced first as "Steampunk", the blank stares usually get me to say that it's a type of really screwy blend of sci-fi and fantasy that's dressed in Victorian era garb. So I agree with the vote that steampunk is a genre based upon how it is used as a descriptive term to describe what is being written. By the way, sky blue, you get a cookie for being awesome, and more wordy than I. :D Thu, 03 Nov 2011 18:31:12 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_442861 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_442861 Custos Stellarum In my opinion, steampunk is more about the feel and look than anything else. It's more of an overriding name for it's own host of genres, much like science fiction includes romance, adventure, mystery, ect. So by comparing it to science fiction, I would agree that it is it's own genre, but I dislike how we group things anyway. Fri, 04 Nov 2011 14:16:29 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_466921 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_466921 mandiiminx A bit off-topic, but does anyone know some examples of books written in the Steam Punk genre? I've read the wiki but I'm finding it a bit hard to understand. It also interests me beyond all reason D: Sat, 05 Nov 2011 08:54:35 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_489491 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_489491 Chibi-Sama Steam punk is technically a sub-genre of Sci-FI. Sat, 05 Nov 2011 11:38:15 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_492560 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_492560 Jack of None [quote=ElizaWyatt]Sure, it's speculative fiction with a good shake of historical fiction in most cases... but we have no metal walls with rivets or crawling space suburbs. Steampunk has no dragons or dwarves, swords or castles or space travel (though sure, we can steal anything we want of the above). [/quote] Uh, a lot of stuff that falls into the sf/f category doesn't feature any of those things either. But then I think Steampunk's claims of being wildly different from anything else are mostly overblown anyway. Sat, 05 Nov 2011 14:44:41 -0500 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_497219 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_497219 acharne No photographic evidence either but can second this! Sun, 06 Nov 2011 11:54:08 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_524449 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_524449 Will64 Steam punk is a Genre. Peace out Sun, 06 Nov 2011 17:27:37 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_533409 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_533409 HuskersGirlLaura Novel named Steamed. - with my half asleep brain, this is one of the very first ones (and at the moment, the almost last one too) my brain can come up with. The Girl With a Steel Corset is another one. Look up Gail Carriager, author, I may have spelled her last name wrong, but I'm notorious for getting author names misspelled. I'll get back to you after I've slept enough to not fall down the stairs to go look at the bookshelf. Sun, 13 Nov 2011 03:28:31 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_672918 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_672918 ADuvall Steampunk is science fiction. Just science fiction in a different era ;D. Sun, 13 Nov 2011 20:23:06 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_683772 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_683772 ADuvall No. It's a sub-genre. Sorry but thats the proper classification. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 01:45:04 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_688566 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_688566 Ramblejack It is very interesting to see how people classify things. Some will see steampunk as purely science fiction, while others will classify both science fiction and fantasy as subgenres of Speculative Fiction. In truth, everything is a branch of something that came before it. To use a dog analogy, if you have a chihuahua that is over five pounds, you will run into chihuahua owners that say it' not a true chihuahua. If you have a deer (deerhound, deer head) chihuahua, there will also be people telling you that your chihuahua is not a 'purebreed.' I've been told my dog is part Jack Russel (?) because a chihuahua can only have an apple head and be under 5 pounds. Now is a deer chihuahua a "subgenre" of chihuahua? Or is it its own breed? Or not a breed at all, but a mutt? Depends on who you talk to. I suspect if it is not already, Steampunk will soon be classified as its own genre. Just my speculative two cents' worth. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 11:51:14 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_693100 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_693100 ADuvall Let me set this straight. Not to be rude midn you. Science Fiction is the Umbrella genre. Steampunk, which does have fantasy elements sometimes, is an obscure sub-genre of Science Fiction. Writers like Lovecraft, Verne, Wells etc. basically helped give birth to Steampunk, which like cyberpunk and biopunk, are all sub-genres of Sci-Fi. *** Steampunk is entirely based off the concept of futuristic technology existing in the past. It is machinery powered by steam. That is all.*** Yes it can have fantasy elements thrown in, but 'true' Steampunk is purely SCIENCE FICTION. It differs yes, because its usually set in the 1880's or 1890's when things like steam power and dirigibles, two staples of the sub-genre, were most common and mostly used. They do this to make it MORE REALISTIC. And less like a fantasty. Because it was possible in some shape or form, but in the end is still fiction. Hence why it falls under Science Fiction. Personally my story I am writing would fall under Science Fiction [sub-genres Steampunk, Dystopia], Fantasy, and Adventure.( I file it under Sci-Fi because I am including things like time and space travel, wormholes, different planets, and heavy Steampunk tones. However I would also label it a bit fantasy because I am including Goblins, and magic in my story as well. And Adventure because it over all would be an adventure.) Just for the record, and so you know I'm not blindly stating these things. I have a fairly good grasp on what Steampunk is. Steampunk, true Steampunk, is science fiction more so than fantasy because it is something that while unrealistic, could have been probable and in a sense, while not as drastic and outlandish as modern Steampunk writers and enthusiasts make it to be, it sorta did exist. Just imagine how amazingly futuristic a zeppelin was to people back in 1890, how top of the line and oh so modern some of the steam power machinery was to them. How classy and new steam engines were? All Steampunk really is, are ideas like that taken to an extreme. Stuff like taking jet packs, which btw are a very real thing, and making them steam powered. There is a fine line between fantasy and fiction. Fantasy includes the use of magic, and things existing that we know would have NEVER been possible. Like Rapunzel, Cinderella, Fairy god mothers. Yes people do incorporate fantasy into Steampunk, and by doing so are turning it into something of its own. Steampunk could form its own genre, it really could. It is gaining enough popularity to become one. However until it defines itself in a more original way aside from the already given definition and makes a drastic stand as its OWN entirely NEW genre, it will remain a subgenre. In conclusion, I am saying, as it stands true Steampunk is currently, and definably a sub-genre of Science fiction. If it were to incorporate more fantasy, and defining rules, which would structure it as something like Sci-fi and Fantasy, but entirely DIFFERENT, then yes it could become its own Genre. It is on its way to doing so, but is not yet it's own genre. It is a sub-genre of Science Fiction. Thats just how the literary world works. Hope this helps, please tell me your views. But thats how I see it, and learned. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 17:59:21 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_698720 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_698720 ADuvall This. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 18:24:05 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_699128 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_699128 ADuvall I'm just going sit here and applaud you for this post. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 18:30:51 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_699232 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_699232 Ramblejack It's always fun to see everyone's opinions on a subject, because they all have valid points. In earlier novels there were things suggested that people were sure were impossible, not just improbable for the time.. At that time it was fantasy. If you look to other people's views such as on the website Steampunk Culture, they say that Steampunk is a Subgenre of fantasy and speculative fiction. If you search another site, it will likely say sci-fi... My view is only that, while Steampunk's roots are found in Science Fiction, that doesn't mean it's not blossoming into a genre in its own right. I'm still standing by the view that every genre is a branch of something earlier...and they all fall under Speculative. But heck, I write mishmash, so it's not surprising I waffle...lol. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:18:08 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_699888 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_699888 Mudge the Expendable Science fiction as an umbrella term is wearing thin. Speculative Fiction has the charm of fitting the existing initials. Hitch: All fiction is speculative. It's like "alternate" history ("alternative" would be the proper part of speech, this just gets up my nose something fierce) as a genre. All historical fiction is alternative history! IT'S FICTION! The author made it up, so it's an alternative to the real thing. So permaybehaps we can go sailing right past the marketing labels as anything other than marketing labels and not apply them to the content of one anothers' novels. The only real use the labels have is store shelving guides, and broad shopper appeal. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 20:27:43 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_700898 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_700898 ADuvall I like that idea. Unfortunately for those of us who want to be published or plan on it, its something we really do need to think on. Our genre will determine how we are marketed, what publisher will pick us up, etc. Its more than just where the books are shelved unfortunately. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 21:50:56 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_702383 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_702383 ADuvall I bastardize my genres and make my books mutts. But yes. I agree with what you said in your last paragraph. As for Speculative fiction, I'm not entirely supportive of that 'genre'. It's too broad. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 21:52:14 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_702404 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_702404 jenifar_kd No, Steam Punk isn't a genre just as New York isn't a country. Steam Punk is a very interesting and extremely readable sub-genre of Science Fiction as it uses a varying application of technology to the current world to tell a story. Frankenstein is science fiction - if Dr Frankenstein had used steam instead of electricity it would have been steam punk Mon, 14 Nov 2011 23:00:02 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_703498 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_703498 Ramblejack [quote=Mudge the Expendable] So permaybehaps we can go sailing right past the marketing labels as anything other than marketing labels and not apply them to the content of one anothers' novels. The only real use the labels have is store shelving guides, and broad shopper appeal. [/quote] heh- I'd be up for writing without labels...if you let me use 'permaybehaps.' I like that. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 23:37:40 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_704041 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_704041 Ramblejack It is true. If you actually want to sell, you do have to generally settle on a genre and target those publishers... Mon, 14 Nov 2011 23:38:47 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_704056 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_704056 Ramblejack [quote=jenifar_kd] No, Steam Punk isn't a genre just as New York isn't a country. [/quote] Oh, New York is definitely a land unto itself...heh. Mon, 14 Nov 2011 23:40:01 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_704070 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_704070 Mudge the Expendable New York, mah homeland, is most definitely not like America. I don't have to show my passport or change my money, but it ain't like the rest of the continent. Tue, 15 Nov 2011 07:34:40 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_707239 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_707239 Mudge the Expendable *stamp* License for limited use granted. Do not disseminate beyond the Territory on pain of prosecution. Tue, 15 Nov 2011 07:35:54 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_707252 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_707252 Mudge the Expendable Okay. Tue, 15 Nov 2011 07:36:58 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_707258 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_707258 ADuvall New York is as American as you get without heading south. Sorry kids. NYCer right here, knock of the self entitlement crap. Tue, 15 Nov 2011 19:03:57 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_716813 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_716813 Mudge the Expendable [quote=ADuvall] New York is as American as you get without heading south. Sorry kids. NYCer right here, knock of the self entitlement crap. [/quote] My, you have a lot of very firm opinions, don't you? Is it a burden, always knowing the answer and being right? Tue, 15 Nov 2011 21:55:44 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_718775 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_718775 ADuvall I'd rather have a firm opinion than a flimsy one. Thanks for the sarcastic veiled insult. Sun, 20 Nov 2011 00:41:32 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_776083 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_776083 slauderdale The Foglios refer to their Girl Genius comics as "Gaslamp Fantasy" rather than "Steam Punk." Sometimes people are aware of a different area of something and just call it something else. Sun, 20 Nov 2011 02:15:55 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_776683 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=1#forum_thread_comment_776683 Ramblejack The truth is, opinions are just that...opinions. We all have them and we don't have to change them if we don't want to. Things like Steampunk being a genre will be open to interpretation as the style grows and becomes more popular. Titles change. And personally, I don't care what the scientists say- Pluto is still a planet. Sun, 20 Nov 2011 12:06:46 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_780312 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_780312 RAveN-838 While the concept of a 'genre' is sort of arbitrary and pointless (in my opinion), my personal opinion on the matter of steampunk is that it is a classification of a subgenre. The mother genre is sci-fi (or ocassionally fantasy...we can have a long discussion about that later, if you like), the sub-genre is retrofuturism (starting with cyberpunk, and now including dieselpunk, atompunk, clockpunk, and of course steampunk). Steampunk is just a form of retrufuturism that is currently very popular (the big one was cyberpunk at first). Voss Fri, 25 Nov 2011 11:21:59 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_840950 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_840950 Ralis We should probably have a new forum because steampunk can't really be put under one specific genre. I think it's a totally new genre... Sun, 27 Nov 2011 19:22:50 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_868452 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_868452 Ramblejack [quote=Ralis] We should probably have a new forum because steampunk can't really be put under one specific genre. I think it's a totally new genre... [/quote] Another good point. Some folks claim it with sci-fi, some with fantasy, some as a spin-off of cyberpunk which is a spin-off of scifi, which is a spin-off of... but I digress. It probably doesn't really matter unless, as ADuvall pointed out, you're trying to sell the little beastie of a manuscript that you write. Then, it's whatever the publisher who wants to buy it wants you to call it. Heck, they can call it Fred if they want to publish my book. Mon, 28 Nov 2011 00:59:07 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_872109 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_872109 keolah New York might not be a country, but California is definitely another planet... ;p Mon, 28 Nov 2011 11:31:32 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_875468 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_875468 Ralis [quote=keolah] New York might not be a country, but California is definitely another planet... ;p [/quote] YES! THAT'S THE TRUTH! XD Mon, 28 Nov 2011 15:29:00 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_877862 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_877862 Glas I would label it as Science Fantasy, Science Fiction is more about "what could be"; where as Steampunk is "what could have been". Looking at the larger picture Steampunk fashion and music veers it even further away from science fiction. Thu, 01 Dec 2011 18:23:25 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_918761 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_918761 Ramblejack [quote=Ralis] [quote=keolah] New York might not be a country, but California is definitely another planet... ;p [/quote] YES! THAT'S THE TRUTH! XD [/quote] Hey! I resemble that remark... Sun, 04 Dec 2011 02:10:41 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_931012 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_931012 Ramblejack [quote=Glas] I would label it as Science Fantasy, Science Fiction is more about "what could be"; where as Steampunk is "what could have been". Looking at the larger picture Steampunk fashion and music veers it even further away from science fiction. [/quote] Another interesting way to look at it... Sun, 04 Dec 2011 02:11:55 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_931015 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_931015 I_Just_Want_To_Fly Steampunk, in my opinion is a mixture of historical and science fiction. It is the fiction of big, ruffly dresses and castles mixed with clocks and gears and technology. It doesn't really fall into anything. Therefore, I consider it its own genre, or at least its own sub-genre. Just as I consider Exogenesis Symphony pt 1 its own genre of music- it could be classical, using techniques used by our ancestors, but at the same time it seems to stretch far into the future, the science fiction of music (but not dubstep, nonononono). But yeah. Steampunk is a sub-genre at least, if not a flat out genre of its own. Sat, 14 Jan 2012 13:53:53 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_1059661 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_1059661 Fatal_Velocity While you can certainly call down umbrella genres clumping smalling things together into an easily managable box we need to get down to how the word genre is used in the modern day. Its a handy label used to identify art/culture that doesn't fit (usually~) fit any other term other than its own. Boundaries may be blurry, your mileage may vary, but surely this is what matters: When a work of fiction can't be describe accurately with any term other than "Steampunk", steampunk becomes a genre. Plenty of fiction has been mentioned in this theard that "doesn't quite fit" anything else. When one of these has been described by the phrase "steampunk" alone, for all intents and perposes it has become genre. Now I know some people will want to highlight the classical use of the word Genre being different from how we use it now, and how we mix it up for setting and aesthetic and many other things at that, but the fact is times change. While some things may not have been technically correct, or even have existed in the past (or the "good old days" depending on how cynical you wish to be hehe) one wonderful property of language is that it is mutable. Okay that's not an angry rant lets get that clear ;) Basically my view boils down to this. When something fits neatly enough with little overlap into a box like Steampunk, it becomes a genre. This is just theory mind you, as with everything. Tue, 17 Jan 2012 16:45:57 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_1068527 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_1068527 Fatal_Velocity In practice... literature is literature :P (sometimes I want to keep quite about edit buttons, but the way I see it the more its called attention to... just saying) Tue, 17 Jan 2012 16:48:27 -0600 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_1068533 http://www.nanowrimo.org/en/forums/other-genres/threads/4842?page=2#forum_thread_comment_1068533